The Better Bilstein Ebay Coilover Thread
#1942
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Is the better ride quality worth the added costs? What is a "slider"
I have tallied up the parts needed: new billy B8s, Swift springs (with helpers would I still do 6"front 7" rear?), (4) ISC top hats, FCM complete coilover bushing kit, and sleeves and am right around $1500. I haven't done much in the way of digging deep for the cheapest price...so dont bite my head off. But this sounds like a good setup?
I have tallied up the parts needed: new billy B8s, Swift springs (with helpers would I still do 6"front 7" rear?), (4) ISC top hats, FCM complete coilover bushing kit, and sleeves and am right around $1500. I haven't done much in the way of digging deep for the cheapest price...so dont bite my head off. But this sounds like a good setup?
#1943
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It doesn't give better ride quality.
The slider is the spring coupler between main spring and helper spring.
With helpers, you would run 6" front and rear. I'd run 6" front and rear even without, but that becomes an opinion piece rather than maths. I get high enough on 6" springs that i don't see any benefit from 7".
You're overpaying for a bunch of stuff. Get Hypercos for cheaper than Swift. Make your own bumpstops rather than paying Shaikh an 800% upcharge. ISC top hats suck, don't buy those. If you have an NA, get Goodwin or Maruhas. If you have an NB, still consider Goodwins in rear, but they will not work in the front. Maruhas will.
At $1500, Bilsteins are a nonstarter. That's Xidas or FEAL 441+RR territory.
The slider is the spring coupler between main spring and helper spring.
With helpers, you would run 6" front and rear. I'd run 6" front and rear even without, but that becomes an opinion piece rather than maths. I get high enough on 6" springs that i don't see any benefit from 7".
You're overpaying for a bunch of stuff. Get Hypercos for cheaper than Swift. Make your own bumpstops rather than paying Shaikh an 800% upcharge. ISC top hats suck, don't buy those. If you have an NA, get Goodwin or Maruhas. If you have an NB, still consider Goodwins in rear, but they will not work in the front. Maruhas will.
At $1500, Bilsteins are a nonstarter. That's Xidas or FEAL 441+RR territory.
#1946
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Is the better ride quality worth the added costs? What is a "slider"
I have tallied up the parts needed: new billy B8s, Swift springs (with helpers would I still do 6"front 7" rear?), (4) ISC top hats, FCM complete coilover bushing kit, and sleeves and am right around $1500. I haven't done much in the way of digging deep for the cheapest price...so dont bite my head off. But this sounds like a good setup?
I have tallied up the parts needed: new billy B8s, Swift springs (with helpers would I still do 6"front 7" rear?), (4) ISC top hats, FCM complete coilover bushing kit, and sleeves and am right around $1500. I haven't done much in the way of digging deep for the cheapest price...so dont bite my head off. But this sounds like a good setup?
#1947
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Indeed, but when you pair two different rate linear springs together you can get a progressive effect. Look at baha racing for examples where they might have three different springs per corner to soak up the rough stuff. Xida and fox are both using helper springs too. The ones you linked are more on a tender spring, only effect they might have is holding the spring in place at full droop.
#1948
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That is also the only effect the additional springs on Xidas have. Well that, and acting as spacers at rest to achieve sane ride heights. With the weight of the car on them, they are at block height.
90% of the internet calls zero rate springs "helpers," and more than that, "tenders."
A "progressive" effect isn't something i'd consider "desirable."
But that's the beauty of this setup. Once you get to these questions, you get to do what you want. Doesn't matter what i think.
Let us know what you put together and how you like it.
90% of the internet calls zero rate springs "helpers," and more than that, "tenders."
A "progressive" effect isn't something i'd consider "desirable."
But that's the beauty of this setup. Once you get to these questions, you get to do what you want. Doesn't matter what i think.
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#1949
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Indeed, but when you pair two different rate linear springs together you can get a progressive effect. Look at baha racing for examples where they might have three different springs per corner to soak up the rough stuff. Xida and fox are both using helper springs too. The ones you linked are more on a tender spring, only effect they might have is holding the spring in place at full droop.
#1950
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Hi All,
Thanks for all the great info throughout this thread. I have a 2002 SE with 101K miles on the original suspension. I'm looking for a Bilstein setup to get fairly lowered look while improving handling. Hoping to be in the 4.5- 5.25 pinch weld height. Here is my shopping list so far.
4 x Allstar Performance ALL64162 Sleeves
4 x Allstar Performance ALL64180 Perchs
2 x Pair of Energy Spring Isolators
4 x Integra Bumpstops cut to length
2 x Bilstein B8 Front
2 x Bilstein B8 Rear
2 x Summit Racing 7" 300lb Spring
2 x Summit Racing 7" 450lb Spring
4 x Maruha extended Tophats
I've seen some people suggest 6" spring vs 7". What is the benefit here? Any drawbacks to the shorter spring?
What are peoples thoughts on 2" ISC top hats vs the Maruha top hats?
Lastly, Are people using these Sleeve and nut set from Advanced Autosports at 4" so they don't have to cut the Allstar ones to length? I'm just trying to avoid rubbing of the sleeve and spring. Thanks for your help everyone. Really looking forward to getting these on the car.
Thanks for all the great info throughout this thread. I have a 2002 SE with 101K miles on the original suspension. I'm looking for a Bilstein setup to get fairly lowered look while improving handling. Hoping to be in the 4.5- 5.25 pinch weld height. Here is my shopping list so far.
4 x Allstar Performance ALL64162 Sleeves
4 x Allstar Performance ALL64180 Perchs
2 x Pair of Energy Spring Isolators
4 x Integra Bumpstops cut to length
2 x Bilstein B8 Front
2 x Bilstein B8 Rear
2 x Summit Racing 7" 300lb Spring
2 x Summit Racing 7" 450lb Spring
4 x Maruha extended Tophats
I've seen some people suggest 6" spring vs 7". What is the benefit here? Any drawbacks to the shorter spring?
What are peoples thoughts on 2" ISC top hats vs the Maruha top hats?
Lastly, Are people using these Sleeve and nut set from Advanced Autosports at 4" so they don't have to cut the Allstar ones to length? I'm just trying to avoid rubbing of the sleeve and spring. Thanks for your help everyone. Really looking forward to getting these on the car.
#1951
![Default](https://www.miataturbo.net/images/icons/icon1.gif)
Hi All,
Thanks for all the great info throughout this thread. I have a 2002 SE with 101K miles on the original suspension. I'm looking for a Bilstein setup to get fairly lowered look while improving handling. Hoping to be in the 4.5- 5.25 pinch weld height. Here is my shopping list so far.
4 x Allstar Performance ALL64162 Sleeves
4 x Allstar Performance ALL64180 Perchs
2 x Pair of Energy Spring Isolators
4 x Integra Bumpstops cut to length
2 x Bilstein B8 Front
2 x Bilstein B8 Rear
2 x Summit Racing 7" 300lb Spring
2 x Summit Racing 7" 450lb Spring
4 x Maruha extended Tophats
I've seen some people suggest 6" spring vs 7". What is the benefit here? Any drawbacks to the shorter spring?
What are peoples thoughts on 2" ISC top hats vs the Maruha top hats?
Lastly, Are people using these Sleeve and nut set from Advanced Autosports at 4" so they don't have to cut the Allstar ones to length? I'm just trying to avoid rubbing of the sleeve and spring. Thanks for your help everyone. Really looking forward to getting these on the car.
Thanks for all the great info throughout this thread. I have a 2002 SE with 101K miles on the original suspension. I'm looking for a Bilstein setup to get fairly lowered look while improving handling. Hoping to be in the 4.5- 5.25 pinch weld height. Here is my shopping list so far.
4 x Allstar Performance ALL64162 Sleeves
4 x Allstar Performance ALL64180 Perchs
2 x Pair of Energy Spring Isolators
4 x Integra Bumpstops cut to length
2 x Bilstein B8 Front
2 x Bilstein B8 Rear
2 x Summit Racing 7" 300lb Spring
2 x Summit Racing 7" 450lb Spring
4 x Maruha extended Tophats
I've seen some people suggest 6" spring vs 7". What is the benefit here? Any drawbacks to the shorter spring?
What are peoples thoughts on 2" ISC top hats vs the Maruha top hats?
Lastly, Are people using these Sleeve and nut set from Advanced Autosports at 4" so they don't have to cut the Allstar ones to length? I'm just trying to avoid rubbing of the sleeve and spring. Thanks for your help everyone. Really looking forward to getting these on the car.
With those rates, and you wanting to get on the low end of the height I'd use the 7" springs to make sure you don't get into a spring bind situation.
#1956
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I have the ISC hats and they are not as pretty but are functional. They do allow greater bump travel than some others if needed.
#1958
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Had my NA up on jack stands for a week, so I finally got around to swapping in the MSM shocks in place of the NA Bilsteins along with TSM tops hats in place of the NB top hats. It's a 100% improvement, so so so much more comfortable. I couldn't believe it. I also installed FM frame rails and a FM front sway bar / end links at the same time. Feels great!
![](https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/48624325113_761d238586_b.jpg)
Untitled by seanbonham69, on Flickr
Cut the sleeves as far down as I could while keeping the top inner centering ring. Drilled the top hats out to fit the stock NB bushings. Turned down the large NB bushing to fit inside the top hat, normal upper bushing installed. 450 /300 springs. No noises thus far... Ride height is about 5"f 5.25"r pinch weld.
![](https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/48624325113_761d238586_b.jpg)
Untitled by seanbonham69, on Flickr
Cut the sleeves as far down as I could while keeping the top inner centering ring. Drilled the top hats out to fit the stock NB bushings. Turned down the large NB bushing to fit inside the top hat, normal upper bushing installed. 450 /300 springs. No noises thus far... Ride height is about 5"f 5.25"r pinch weld.
#1959
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@concealer404 will the Maruha top hats work with the recessed nuts that are on the FCM shock assemblies I have? For the rear? Would I only need to bore out the center hole to pass the nut? Is there a better approach? Do I even need new top hats if I stay high? I'm thinking, why not, insurance for travel.
This is non-standard, but the path I'm on is:
Move the 325# to rear with use of Allstar sleeves to get to 5.75 height, if desired (sleeves are mounted very low on these shocks).
New 425# for the front.
Eibach 1 1/16 solid front bar. (Nearly as stiff as the 1.25 hollow RB, more weight, less $$$).
I did not contact FCM, but am going on the assumption that I can add 100#/in to the front and 50 #/in to the rear and the shocks can handle it.
DNM
This is non-standard, but the path I'm on is:
Move the 325# to rear with use of Allstar sleeves to get to 5.75 height, if desired (sleeves are mounted very low on these shocks).
New 425# for the front.
Eibach 1 1/16 solid front bar. (Nearly as stiff as the 1.25 hollow RB, more weight, less $$$).
I did not contact FCM, but am going on the assumption that I can add 100#/in to the front and 50 #/in to the rear and the shocks can handle it.
DNM