i beat an sti
#141
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20whp different at what power lever? 20whp at ~150hp is a big difference, but at ~350hp... not so much. there are enough variables between the two cars that you could easily see a 20whp variance at "the same" boost level, different ECU's or not.
as far as max power goes, theres no way that an AEM magically makes more power. the MS (especially MS2) has plenty of resolution, and it can fire the SAME injectors and the SAME coils as the AEM.
wheres the difference? same motor, same coil, same amount of fuel and the same amount of ignition advance... there is none!
as far as max power goes, theres no way that an AEM magically makes more power. the MS (especially MS2) has plenty of resolution, and it can fire the SAME injectors and the SAME coils as the AEM.
wheres the difference? same motor, same coil, same amount of fuel and the same amount of ignition advance... there is none!
20 hp? I bet they were running different mufflers. Or different viscosity oil. Or different wheel/tire combos. Or different intercooler dimensions. Or different air filters. Or different exhaust manifolds. Or different rear-end gearing. Or different trim turbos. Or different gap spark plugs. Or different thermostats. Or different ambient temps. Or different fuel pumps. Or different cam timing. Or different wastegate sizes. Or different boost by half a psi. Or different turbo heatshielding. Or different inlet air temperatures. Or different mass flywheels. Or different air pressure in the driven wheels.
Nah. Couldn't be. He said it was the ECU.
Nah. Couldn't be. He said it was the ECU.
Different viscosity oil - It's possible
Different wheel/tire combos - yes
Different intercooler dimensions - No, all were running our custom FMIC Kit
Different air filters - Yes
Different exhaust manifolds - stock
Different rear-end gearing - stock
Different trim turbos - stock
Different gap spark plugs - It's possible
Different thermostats - it's possible. They were all cold for their pulls.
Different ambient temps - It's possible
Different fuel pumps - possible, but none were extreme enough to test the stock one
Different cam timing - stock
Different wastegate sizes - stock
Different boost by half a psi - they log by MAP, all were running same max BAR
Different turbo heatshielding - stock
Different inlet air temperatures - It's possible
Different mass flywheels - It's possible
Different air pressure in the driven wheels - It's possible
None of that would add up to 20whp. Especially with the advantage of a better flowing exhaust.
my evo would **** on all of u in reverse lol but not to brag or anything at one time i had a turbo bigger than ur engine. but i have tuned many subarus and raced many they just are overrated and have weak engines. over 400whp is hard to achieve safely it takes a lot of money and knowledge. my old sponsor had a bug eye wrx that stomped on most evos it was hilarious but other than that i have not seen a sti or wrx that i respect at all. but wat he said about driver factor on awd cars is huge i kno a guy had a audi rs4 and lost to a a3 lol my friend when he first got his wrx lost to a saturn ion haha so driver error mixed with shitty build can equal and embarrasing race. and ur ballsy running 10psi on greddy without ems of some type or fueling. to each his own impressive either way
What yr Evo? Mods? Whp?
I have seen some nasty Evos and WRX/STi's. The owner's Evo makes 451whp on pump. 770whp on race.
![](http://www.turbocelica.com/TheShuttle/OnTheDyno/Images/Chris106-Brice049.gif)
This is his Evo and a ST185 Celica GT4 we helped build. The ST185 has a 2.2l stroker in it, so it makes more torque.
We have a Subie in the gulf that runs 8s on a built motor and tune we did. Either can be sick fast with enough investment.
#143
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my evo would **** on all of u in reverse lol but not to brag or anything at one time i had a turbo bigger than ur engine. but i have tuned many subarus and raced many they just are overrated and have weak engines. over 400whp is hard to achieve safely it takes a lot of money and knowledge. my old sponsor had a bug eye wrx that stomped on most evos it was hilarious but other than that i have not seen a sti or wrx that i respect at all. but wat he said about driver factor on awd cars is huge i kno a guy had a audi rs4 and lost to a a3 lol my friend when he first got his wrx lost to a saturn ion haha so driver error mixed with shitty build can equal and embarrasing race. and ur ballsy running 10psi on greddy without ems of some type or fueling. to each his own impressive either way
Does anyone have an extra keyboard? Maybe a used one? Help a brother out?
And Ray,
A ten percent variance could be easily attributed to any combination of the above factors, and not necessarily rest at the feet of the ECU.
I left out variances in the injector flow and spray patterns from my list.
Different weight/diameter wheel and tire packages can cost you 4 tenths in the quarter mile.
I know they will effect an inertial dyno because of the difference in effective gearing. Additionally the acceleration of the rotational mass is what is being measured, and a pair of heavier or taller wheels and tires will accelerate more slowly when the same HP is applied, thereby skewing the results.
#144
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You guys, the world is wrong and Ray is right. That's pretty much it.
Also, I would encourage everyone to do their part to support the forum.
https://www.miataturbo.net/forum/t31619/
Also, I would encourage everyone to do their part to support the forum.
https://www.miataturbo.net/forum/t31619/
#145
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my list of mods for the evo is too long and went through different periods based on wat i was into at the time drag, street racing, canyons, track, rally, and tired of breaking **** lol. i went through 37r, 35r, fp green, white rabbit, stock evo VIII, evo IX, had twin scrolls and htas lol i ran open ecu ecuflash and AEM EMS, lots of methanol, built 2.0 had hks 272s, 280s, tomies, and juns, 3 different ported heads, TRE stage 3 trans with gearing shotpeening, and cryo, shep xcase with all the fixings including cusco lsd, i think shep rear diff too cant remember if shep or tre. ran ACT custom clutch setup with AMS stainless lines for the entire thing because i kept blowing lines AND fittings. stock brembos with project mu titan kai pads and rotors stainless lines. volk ce28ns, avr or something rims and evo viii enkies and nt03s. exhaust was 3.5 turbo back, 3" turbo backs rsr, hks, greddy ti, buddyclub, custom, and stock with qtp cutout and just straight out of the turbo lol. rc 750 injectors, 1000's, 1200s, and miraculously only 1 fuel pump walbro 255lph haha idk thats a small chunk of the stuff i had in that car it was a 3 year timeline of builds and re builds haha. had stock VIII suspension, jic flta2s, swift springs on MR bilsteins, idk so much stuff but my highest dyno was like 720awhp with the 37r that was on c16 with no meth. i usually just ran tons of methanol VP M1 and M3 about 1350cc dual nozzle of 650ish and attempted direct port but got lazy. fast car man very fast fun too. just way to much money and issues with all that power i abuse my cars beyond wat any mechanic has ever seen. i was told that my evo has been beaten and abused more than any full race evo or street evo than some of the biggest evo shops have ever seen haha. i like to think i actually used my evo for wat i was made and designed for unlike most people who just show them my car was beat and ugly but had character lol.
#146
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You once had a turbo bigger than 1.6 liters? That doesn't make any sense.
#147
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Easy hoss, some of my best friends have EVOs, they are a blast but the owners still realize they have a > $30k car to my < $6k car (stock for stock). My favorite one is a 10 second car (stock turbo, lots of psi, meth, etc.) that still handles well. Talk about a beast.. but running your mouth like you're doing won't do anything to dispel the perception that all EVO owners are stuck up douchenozzles.
You once had a turbo bigger than 1.6 liters? That doesn't make any sense.
You once had a turbo bigger than 1.6 liters? That doesn't make any sense.
#148
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even though this thread is full of massive HIV gayness...I've never heard anyone bitch about Bryce's tuning or a bad experience. Even though I have an inferior computer in the car, I'm going to take it to Alamo for the next round of tuning.
"We've" been taking VW's to that dyno for over a decade with no horror stories...just awesome power with low boost pressures and small turbos. I miss the glory days of streetracing with the VW/DSM crew.
Nathan, I may come visit you guys on saturday just to say hi. If Savington would send my COPs, I'd come by with cash for tuning.
edit: street racing is gay. Be a man and get skull-fucked by Hustler on the track. Hopefully I'll get to do an Apex day soon, then Keith Verges will get pissed off enough to come play on the track. I see him as the benchmark in TX right now. I have the equipment now...time to bring skill to the table...and I know I have a lot to learn.
"We've" been taking VW's to that dyno for over a decade with no horror stories...just awesome power with low boost pressures and small turbos. I miss the glory days of streetracing with the VW/DSM crew.
Nathan, I may come visit you guys on saturday just to say hi. If Savington would send my COPs, I'd come by with cash for tuning.
edit: street racing is gay. Be a man and get skull-fucked by Hustler on the track. Hopefully I'll get to do an Apex day soon, then Keith Verges will get pissed off enough to come play on the track. I see him as the benchmark in TX right now. I have the equipment now...time to bring skill to the table...and I know I have a lot to learn.
#151
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my list of mods for the evo is too long and went through different periods based on wat i was into at the time drag, street racing, canyons, track, rally, and tired of breaking **** lol. i went through 37r, 35r, fp green, white rabbit, stock evo VIII, evo IX, had twin scrolls and htas lol i ran open ecu ecuflash and AEM EMS, lots of methanol, built 2.0 had hks 272s, 280s, tomies, and juns, 3 different ported heads, TRE stage 3 trans with gearing shotpeening, and cryo, shep xcase with all the fixings including cusco lsd, i think shep rear diff too cant remember if shep or tre. ran ACT custom clutch setup with AMS stainless lines for the entire thing because i kept blowing lines AND fittings. stock brembos with project mu titan kai pads and rotors stainless lines. volk ce28ns, avr or something rims and evo viii enkies and nt03s. exhaust was 3.5 turbo back, 3" turbo backs rsr, hks, greddy ti, buddyclub, custom, and stock with qtp cutout and just straight out of the turbo lol. rc 750 injectors, 1000's, 1200s, and miraculously only 1 fuel pump walbro 255lph haha idk thats a small chunk of the stuff i had in that car it was a 3 year timeline of builds and re builds haha. had stock VIII suspension, jic flta2s, swift springs on MR bilsteins, idk so much stuff but my highest dyno was like 720awhp with the 37r that was on c16 with no meth. i usually just ran tons of methanol VP M1 and M3 about 1350cc dual nozzle of 650ish and attempted direct port but got lazy. fast car man very fast fun too. just way to much money and issues with all that power i abuse my cars beyond wat any mechanic has ever seen. i was told that my evo has been beaten and abused more than any full race evo or street evo than some of the biggest evo shops have ever seen haha. i like to think i actually used my evo for wat i was made and designed for unlike most people who just show them my car was beat and ugly but had character lol.
#154
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my list of mods for the evo is too long and went through different periods based on wat i was into at the time drag, street racing, canyons, track, rally, and tired of breaking **** lol. i went through 37r, 35r, fp green, white rabbit, stock evo VIII, evo IX, had twin scrolls and htas lol i ran open ecu ecuflash and AEM EMS, lots of methanol, built 2.0 had hks 272s, 280s, tomies, and juns, 3 different ported heads, TRE stage 3 trans with gearing shotpeening, and cryo, shep xcase with all the fixings including cusco lsd, i think shep rear diff too cant remember if shep or tre. ran ACT custom clutch setup with AMS stainless lines for the entire thing because i kept blowing lines AND fittings. stock brembos with project mu titan kai pads and rotors stainless lines. volk ce28ns, avr or something rims and evo viii enkies and nt03s. exhaust was 3.5 turbo back, 3" turbo backs rsr, hks, greddy ti, buddyclub, custom, and stock with qtp cutout and just straight out of the turbo lol. rc 750 injectors, 1000's, 1200s, and miraculously only 1 fuel pump walbro 255lph haha idk thats a small chunk of the stuff i had in that car it was a 3 year timeline of builds and re builds haha. had stock VIII suspension, jic flta2s, swift springs on MR bilsteins, idk so much stuff but my highest dyno was like 720awhp with the 37r that was on c16 with no meth. i usually just ran tons of methanol VP M1 and M3 about 1350cc dual nozzle of 650ish and attempted direct port but got lazy. fast car man very fast fun too. just way to much money and issues with all that power i abuse my cars beyond wat any mechanic has ever seen. i was told that my evo has been beaten and abused more than any full race evo or street evo than some of the biggest evo shops have ever seen haha. i like to think i actually used my evo for wat i was made and designed for unlike most people who just show them my car was beat and ugly but had character lol.my list of mods for the evo is too long and went through different periods based on wat i was into at the time drag, street racing, canyons, track, rally, and tired of breaking **** lol. i went through 37r, 35r, fp green, white rabbit, stock evo VIII, evo IX, had twin scrolls and htas lol i ran open ecu ecuflash and AEM EMS, lots of methanol, built 2.0 had hks 272s, 280s, tomies, and juns, 3 different ported heads, TRE stage 3 trans with gearing shotpeening, and cryo, shep xcase with all the fixings including cusco lsd, i think shep rear diff too cant remember if shep or tre. ran ACT custom clutch setup with AMS stainless lines for the entire thing because i kept blowing lines AND fittings. stock brembos with project mu titan kai pads and rotors stainless lines. volk ce28ns, avr or something rims and evo viii enkies and nt03s. exhaust was 3.5 turbo back, 3" turbo backs rsr, hks, greddy ti, buddyclub, custom, and stock with qtp cutout and just straight out of the turbo lol. rc 750 injectors, 1000's, 1200s, and miraculously only 1 fuel pump walbro 255lph haha idk thats a small chunk of the stuff i had in that car it was a 3 year timeline of builds and re builds haha. had stock VIII suspension, jic flta2s, swift springs on MR bilsteins, idk so much stuff but my highest dyno was like 720awhp with the 37r that was on c16 with no meth. i usually just ran tons of methanol VP M1 and M3 about 1350cc dual nozzle of 650ish and attempted direct port but got lazy. fast car man very fast fun too. just way to much money and issues with all that power i abuse my cars beyond wat any mechanic has ever seen. i was told that my evo has been beaten and abused more than any full race evo or street evo than some of the biggest evo shops have ever seen haha. i like to think i actually used my evo for wat i was made and designed for unlike most people who just show them my car was beat and ugly but had character lol.my list of mods for the evo is too long and went through different periods based on wat i was into at the time drag, street racing, canyons, track, rally, and tired of breaking **** lol. i went through 37r, 35r, fp green, white rabbit, stock evo VIII, evo IX, had twin scrolls and htas lol i ran open ecu ecuflash and AEM EMS, lots of methanol, built 2.0 had hks 272s, 280s, tomies, and juns, 3 different ported heads, TRE stage 3 trans with gearing shotpeening, and cryo, shep xcase with all the fixings including cusco lsd, i think shep rear diff too cant remember if shep or tre. ran ACT custom clutch setup with AMS stainless lines for the entire thing because i kept blowing lines AND fittings. stock brembos with project mu titan kai pads and rotors stainless lines. volk ce28ns, avr or something rims and evo viii enkies and nt03s. exhaust was 3.5 turbo back, 3" turbo backs rsr, hks, greddy ti, buddyclub, custom, and stock with qtp cutout and just straight out of the turbo lol. rc 750 injectors, 1000's, 1200s, and miraculously only 1 fuel pump walbro 255lph haha idk thats a small chunk of the stuff i had in that car it was a 3 year timeline of builds and re builds haha. had stock VIII suspension, jic flta2s, swift springs on MR bilsteins, idk so much stuff but my highest dyno was like 720awhp with the 37r that was on c16 with no meth. i usually just ran tons of methanol VP M1 and M3 about 1350cc dual nozzle of 650ish and attempted direct port but got lazy. fast car man very fast fun too. just way to much money and issues with all that power i abuse my cars beyond wat any mechanic has ever seen. i was told that my evo has been beaten and abused more than any full race evo or street evo than some of the biggest evo shops have ever seen haha. i like to think i actually used my evo for wat i was made and designed for unlike most people who just show them my car was beat and ugly but had character lol.
Somebody change his name to "Neo", will you? Or "jdmcwestneo."
He's jdm, yo! And evo, yo, yo! And obviously way too trendy and cool for me.
This has got to stop.
If I wanted to associate with cool and trendy people I wouldn't be modding a Miata.
#155
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Different mufflers - yes, several different mufflers (MS car was only one running full exhaust)
Different viscosity oil - It's possible
Different wheel/tire combos - yes
Different intercooler dimensions - No, all were running our custom FMIC Kit
Different air filters - Yes
Different exhaust manifolds - stock
Different rear-end gearing - stock
Different trim turbos - stock
Different gap spark plugs - It's possible
Different thermostats - it's possible. They were all cold for their pulls.
Different ambient temps - It's possible
Different fuel pumps - possible, but none were extreme enough to test the stock one
Different cam timing - stock
Different wastegate sizes - stock
Different boost by half a psi - they log by MAP, all were running same max BAR
Different turbo heatshielding - stock
Different inlet air temperatures - It's possible
Different mass flywheels - It's possible
Different air pressure in the driven wheels - It's possible
None of that would add up to 20whp. Especially with the advantage of a better flowing exhaust.
It's the same thing that's said about weight reduction. One pound from twenty places adds up to twenty pounds saved. Similarly a little loss of power here and there could easily add up to 20hp. It is impossible to make a true comparison of anything if the circumstances are so different. Where's the control element?
#157
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even though this thread is full of massive HIV gayness...I've never heard anyone bitch about Bryce's tuning or a bad experience. Even though I have an inferior computer in the car, I'm going to take it to Alamo for the next round of tuning.
"We've" been taking VW's to that dyno for over a decade with no horror stories...just awesome power with low boost pressures and small turbos. I miss the glory days of streetracing with the VW/DSM crew.
Nathan, I may come visit you guys on saturday just to say hi. If Savington would send my COPs, I'd come by with cash for tuning.
edit: street racing is gay. Be a man and get skull-fucked by Hustler on the track. Hopefully I'll get to do an Apex day soon, then Keith Verges will get pissed off enough to come play on the track. I see him as the benchmark in TX right now. I have the equipment now...time to bring skill to the table...and I know I have a lot to learn.
"We've" been taking VW's to that dyno for over a decade with no horror stories...just awesome power with low boost pressures and small turbos. I miss the glory days of streetracing with the VW/DSM crew.
Nathan, I may come visit you guys on saturday just to say hi. If Savington would send my COPs, I'd come by with cash for tuning.
edit: street racing is gay. Be a man and get skull-fucked by Hustler on the track. Hopefully I'll get to do an Apex day soon, then Keith Verges will get pissed off enough to come play on the track. I see him as the benchmark in TX right now. I have the equipment now...time to bring skill to the table...and I know I have a lot to learn.
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#158
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Yep, can't wait to shake the car down and make sure its going to be ready to run all day out there. I've spent a lot of time in a 94whp car, working on skills and trying to make the most of the knowledge base. I'm excited to finally have a car that can play with the adults. Are you going to drive your car, or the secret driver with the secret spark table? lol
#159
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Yep, can't wait to shake the car down and make sure its going to be ready to run all day out there. I've spent a lot of time in a 94whp car, working on skills and trying to make the most of the knowledge base. I'm excited to finally have a car that can play with the adults. Are you going to drive your car, or the secret driver with the secret spark table? lol