ITT: MS3X VVT settings and tuning
#1
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ITT: MS3X VVT settings and tuning
The current firmware revision is pre-1.1 beta 19. PID values and settings may change as the firmware changes.
What are y'all running for VVT settings?
I have noted that Revereant scoped the stock ECU output at 285hz.
I am currently running at 253hz. I started at 153hz, as JasonC was running ~100hz on his AEM, but my solenoid buzzed quite loudly.
Adjust injector timing: Off - I'm thinking I should turn that setting on because I am changing when the valves are opening and closing.
Minimum angle: 277.5
Maximum angle: 323.5
More Duty=advance
Use Hold Duty: Off
My PID settings are all 50. I have played with them for an hour and gotten nowhere. I want to see other people's settings so I can ballpark them and go from there. The default 50,50,50 causes such spasmodical oscillations that my 92 OPG bounces like it would with detonation.
Targets:
This is what I interpolated from the basemap of the VVTtuner. Y8s have given me some input for changes I need to make to it. No advance over 5000 rpm. Taper from full advance at 3500 to none at 5000. No advance below 3000 and 70kpa.
My current setup is stock VVT motor with VICS Intake manifold. I/H/test pipe with stock catback. I have a 1N4001 diode, banded end towards 12V, soldered in right at the VVT solenoid.
What are y'all running for VVT settings?
I have noted that Revereant scoped the stock ECU output at 285hz.
I am currently running at 253hz. I started at 153hz, as JasonC was running ~100hz on his AEM, but my solenoid buzzed quite loudly.
Adjust injector timing: Off - I'm thinking I should turn that setting on because I am changing when the valves are opening and closing.
Minimum angle: 277.5
Maximum angle: 323.5
More Duty=advance
Use Hold Duty: Off
My PID settings are all 50. I have played with them for an hour and gotten nowhere. I want to see other people's settings so I can ballpark them and go from there. The default 50,50,50 causes such spasmodical oscillations that my 92 OPG bounces like it would with detonation.
Targets:
This is what I interpolated from the basemap of the VVTtuner. Y8s have given me some input for changes I need to make to it. No advance over 5000 rpm. Taper from full advance at 3500 to none at 5000. No advance below 3000 and 70kpa.
My current setup is stock VVT motor with VICS Intake manifold. I/H/test pipe with stock catback. I have a 1N4001 diode, banded end towards 12V, soldered in right at the VVT solenoid.
Last edited by Bryce; 03-28-2012 at 12:23 AM.
#2
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First, my settings:
-- VVT Settings --
Frequency: 306 Hz
On/Off or PID: PID
Adjust inj. timing based on: Cam 1
Commanded vs. actual: Actual
Control Interval: Synced to cam
Range check measured angles: Yes
--PID Parameters--
Intake
More duty means: Advance
Use hold duty: Off
Porportional Gain: 50
Integral Gain: 17
Differential Gain: 130
-- Cam Settings --
CAM1
Input: Main cam
Output: Nitrous2
Minimum: 275.0
Maximum: 319.0
int.exh.: Intake
Map:
-- VVT Settings --
Frequency: 306 Hz
On/Off or PID: PID
Adjust inj. timing based on: Cam 1
Commanded vs. actual: Actual
Control Interval: Synced to cam
Range check measured angles: Yes
--PID Parameters--
Intake
More duty means: Advance
Use hold duty: Off
Porportional Gain: 50
Integral Gain: 17
Differential Gain: 130
-- Cam Settings --
CAM1
Input: Main cam
Output: Nitrous2
Minimum: 275.0
Maximum: 319.0
int.exh.: Intake
Map:
#4
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My PID settings are all 50. I have played with them for an hour and gotten nowhere. I want to see other people's settings so I can ballpark them and go from there. The default 50,50,50 causes such spasmodical oscillations that my 92 OPG bounces like it would with detonation.
Like you saw me say before, keep things fully retarded at idle. Notice I have mine set to actually below zero to force the cam to full retard.
Also I mentioned not running any/much advance below 70kPa. We probably don't have the means of testing the effects very well of advancing the cam during cruise, but it can lead to reversion since there is significant overlap at the highest advance numbers. Even at full retard, the intake valves are just starting to open right as the exhaust valves close.
If you want to try to get more MPG, you can do some back to back freeway tuning and advance in 5 degree increments and see if the fuel usage rate increases or decreases. it may be hard to measure though. telltale positive signs would be (for same cruise RPM), higher TPS and lower PW while still maintaining speed (rpm)
good. it'll prevent frying the flyback circuit.
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Y8s, why the negative "force-to-zero" numbers at idle? Doesn't that create a delay and then maybe overshoot in response when the duty shoots up as you come off idle? Not that a delay would be very noticable here, but it's just a thought. Why is that better than say 0.2* at idle or something?
#6
Maybe I'm on the crack.
If you want to try to get more MPG, you can do some back to back freeway tuning and advance in 5 degree increments and see if the fuel usage rate increases or decreases. it may be hard to measure though. telltale positive signs would be (for same cruise RPM), higher TPS and lower PW while still maintaining speed (rpm)
#7
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What I don't get is why the switch points are so rapid. Why have VVT when you could have vtech, then? There's no analog going on here (well, there's a bit in your 12/19/whatever) but I'm surprised you don't see slow movements from one place to another. I guess when you switch past a resonance peak you need to jump to the other side to pick up the next, but in windows I would think you'd want to follow the pressure waves.
Maybe I'm on the crack.
Maybe I'm on the crack.
Also, it's analog likely for reasons beyond pure power. It could also be an emissions thing. I know VVT is used in some cases to keep combusted material in the chamber similar to EGR.
#14
Copied from Y8S post with my comments/observations in blue
-- VVT Settings --
Frequency: 511 Hz we're using a different output than Y8S
On/Off or PID: PID
Adjust inj. timing based on: Cam 1
Commanded vs. actual: Actual
Control Interval: Synced to cam
Range check measured angles: Yes
--PID Parameters--
Intake
More duty means: Advance
Use hold duty: Off - I set this to off when done but the value in grayed out, supposedly disabled, window affects target. So set this to on, select value then set it to off. Takes a few tries to get a stable target vs actual at idle. No idea why this works this way but it does.
Proportional Gain: 50- varies
Integral Gain: 17 - varies
Differential Gain: 130 - varies. I have never needed more gain than about 30 to get good targets
-- Cam Settings --
CAM1
Input: Main cam
Output: Nitrous2
Minimum: 275.0 - varies
Maximum: 319.0 - varies. I always make sure the spread is 45°. Y8S is 44° here
int.exh.: Intake
__________________
#16
Recently, we've fitted a VVT motor with a Flyin' Miata trigger wheel and had James put together some experimental code to decode the FM trigger with a Miata cam sensor. This is giving us more accurate data on what the cam is doing and we are using this to improve the VVT control. However, the final results of this development are still not out yet.
#18
Recently, we've fitted a VVT motor with a Flyin' Miata trigger wheel and had James put together some experimental code to decode the FM trigger with a Miata cam sensor. This is giving us more accurate data on what the cam is doing and we are using this to improve the VVT control. However, the final results of this development are still not out yet.
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#20
Which means... everyone's table should be offset by the min angle difference from their's to someone else's.
I did a super-quick, @ idle check and the numbers were bouncing so I only got 41 degrees of spread. I'll try again at higher rpm, I just wanted to see if the solenoid was working.
Use hold duty: Off - I set this to off when done but the value in grayed out, supposedly disabled, window affects target. So set this to on, select value then set it to off. Takes a few tries to get a stable target vs actual at idle. No idea why this works this way but it does.
I, too, am excited to see variation across boost levels, not sure the dyno access I'll get when I get it.