Cranking and ASE tuning
#1
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I am not understanding the cranking pulse theory. I have taken a ridiculous amount of fuel out, and I still open the throttle to start. Do I start at zero?
When ASE blips on ultra-momentarily during cranking over 300rpm, does it flip to that map?
Start attempts: 1, 2, third using throttle.
![](https://www.miataturbo.net/attachment.php?attachmentid=58764&dateline=1351694506)
![](https://www.miataturbo.net/attachment.php?attachmentid=58765&dateline=1351694506)
![](https://www.miataturbo.net/attachment.php?attachmentid=58766&dateline=1351694506)
![](https://www.miataturbo.net/attachments/megasquirt-18/58216-cranking-ase-tuning-untitled-25.png?dateline=1351039814)
![](https://www.miataturbo.net/attachments/megasquirt-18/58217-cranking-ase-tuning-untitled-26.png?dateline=1351039814)
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When ASE blips on ultra-momentarily during cranking over 300rpm, does it flip to that map?
Start attempts: 1, 2, third using throttle.
![](https://www.miataturbo.net/attachments/megasquirt-18/58216-cranking-ase-tuning-untitled-25.png?dateline=1351039814)
![](https://www.miataturbo.net/attachments/megasquirt-18/58217-cranking-ase-tuning-untitled-26.png?dateline=1351039814)
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Last edited by Braineack; 10-31-2012 at 10:41 AM.
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That is important information. I understood that the cranking RPM was when the table switched to run, but I hadn't thought that it would switch the fuel abruptly. Should the cranking rpm be adjusted to the max rpm seen while just cranking?
Does this mean adding a row below 1000 is necessary to help transition to running? This area will never get VEAL, so it would require manually inputting values between cranking PW and VE?
Does this mean adding a row below 1000 is necessary to help transition to running? This area will never get VEAL, so it would require manually inputting values between cranking PW and VE?
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Thanks for responding Matt.
I raised cranking rpm to 550 and it seemed to change things.
Nice comfortable temperature this afternoon so I dropped cranking down to 20% and worked my way up to 60% where it started without throttle. Still not a perfect start, but better.
I see differences between logs, but still not sure what is changing what.
60%
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Req fuel=11.9
Stock 1999 injectors
I raised cranking rpm to 550 and it seemed to change things.
Nice comfortable temperature this afternoon so I dropped cranking down to 20% and worked my way up to 60% where it started without throttle. Still not a perfect start, but better.
I see differences between logs, but still not sure what is changing what.
60%
![Name: Untitled-28.png
Views: 1299
Size: 135.7 KB](https://www.miataturbo.net/attachments/megasquirt-18/185726d1501211754-cranking-ase-tuning-untitled-28.png)
55%
![Name: Untitled-29.png
Views: 1205
Size: 127.7 KB](https://www.miataturbo.net/attachments/megasquirt-18/185727d1501211754-cranking-ase-tuning-untitled-29.png)
20%
![Name: Untitled-30.png
Views: 1214
Size: 126.1 KB](https://www.miataturbo.net/attachments/megasquirt-18/185728d1501211754-cranking-ase-tuning-untitled-30.png)
Req fuel=11.9
Stock 1999 injectors
![](https://www.miataturbo.net/attachments/megasquirt-18/58317-cranking-ase-tuning-untitled-31.png?dateline=1351128816)
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Does this mean adding a row below 1000 is necessary to help transition to running? This area will never get VEAL, so it would require manually inputting values between cranking PW and VE?
OP, where are you getting your cranking pulse values? The values in the DIY base map are a good place to start. Mine are tweaked only slightly from those and nowhere in my cranking table is there a value less than 100%. After you turn the key it shouldn't take any longer than whir-whir-whir-start. Should not need any throttle, and if you step on the pedal too much (I think the default is 70% TPS) it will go into flood clear mode (no fuel injected).
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#7
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OP, where are you getting your cranking pulse values? The values in the DIY base map are a good place to start. Mine are tweaked only slightly from those and nowhere in my cranking table is there a value less than 100%. After you turn the key it shouldn't take any longer than whir-whir-whir-start. Should not need any throttle, and if you step on the pedal too much (I think the default is 70% TPS) it will go into flood clear mode (no fuel injected).
With that much fuel, I had to crank first, then crank with flood clear mode engaged for it to catch and start. That, plus many cranking threads referring to starting 'low' ended me with the bonehead numbers above.
Past few weeks I had been cranking at 50% and still having to slightly crack the throttle, maybe 10%, to start.
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please have a look at the log and MSQ. I have another log that is over the upload size limit.
Here is something I thought of while driving home in a borrowed car: I made changes to the VE table in the upper RPM range since I planned to autotune. I do not believe that I ever power-cycled the MS. Could have been my problem??
I tried varying the cranking value to no avail. I even tried starter spray.
Here is something I thought of while driving home in a borrowed car: I made changes to the VE table in the upper RPM range since I planned to autotune. I do not believe that I ever power-cycled the MS. Could have been my problem??
I tried varying the cranking value to no avail. I even tried starter spray.
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Paging Braineak:
I remember us changing something about the rising/falling stuff earlier this year while trouble shooting something else. I'll look through the emails.
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#16
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Brain, am I allowed to change the rising/falling edge setting? Any other thoughts?
Check out 3rdcar's thread: https://www.miataturbo.net/megasquir...ranking-67806/
I see both sych losses going back to logs when I first got the car running on MS. This must be the reason why I have been having issues cranking.
Does not synch loss after start. Only while cranking.
31 = Miata 99-00 - 2 cams not seen
32 = Miata 99-00 - 0 cams seen
Seems like the only threads where moving the sensor closer is necessary is when the synch losses occur while driving. Seen a few threads where it is purely software settings. Promising...
Check out 3rdcar's thread: https://www.miataturbo.net/megasquir...ranking-67806/
I see both sych losses going back to logs when I first got the car running on MS. This must be the reason why I have been having issues cranking.
Does not synch loss after start. Only while cranking.
31 = Miata 99-00 - 2 cams not seen
32 = Miata 99-00 - 0 cams seen
Seems like the only threads where moving the sensor closer is necessary is when the synch losses occur while driving. Seen a few threads where it is purely software settings. Promising...
#18
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This will help a lot. Please do the above (screen shot it if you can right now, I cant open a composite log here)
But please refresh my memory: You have an Ms2 w/harness for your '99, right, and not a black DIYPNP box?
If so I built the AbeFM inputs, so you need Falling Edge, not Rising. The map you posted appears to be on rising.
Looking at your logs I can tell it's the sync loss that's causing all the havoc.
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Thanks Matt and brain.
I do not have a recent composite log. Next time I will be around the car is the 10th. I will flip from rising to falling edge and log all the things.
Correct, I have a ms2 with harness for my 99, and not a black diypnp box.
I do not have a recent composite log. Next time I will be around the car is the 10th. I will flip from rising to falling edge and log all the things.
Correct, I have a ms2 with harness for my 99, and not a black diypnp box.