MSM into a 99.
#41
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Today I got my new MSM Engine into Ryu and bolted down.
![](https://www.miataturbo.net/attachments/general-miata-chat-9/146431-msm-into-99-c49397a7-e3aa-417e-b430-024eedf7a795_zpsrluedage.jpg?dateline=1439089730)
This took about three hours, as for the most of it I was working alone. I had some help in the end, which made it a LOT easier.
I also started to install the inter-cooler plumbing. However, I quickly found that the driver's side headlight would be an issue. I pretty much knew it would anyway, as it covers the hole that the piping uses to go thru the body.
![](https://www.miataturbo.net/attachments/general-miata-chat-9/146432-msm-into-99-02a89559-ee01-48bc-a794-4b183e0585e2_zpsdftbgtow.jpg?dateline=1439089730)
This left me with two choices.. Buy new piping and reroute it... Or modify my headlight. Since I have a spare set of headlights and I am glutton for punishment.... I went with the modification route.
All I did was cut away the back corner of the housing. I will reseal it once I make some minor adjustments.
![](https://www.miataturbo.net/attachments/general-miata-chat-9/146433-msm-into-99-44d9ccd8-dd37-4144-be1a-aa31e1edb7c2_zpsoqumfsuo.jpg?dateline=1439089730)
![](https://www.miataturbo.net/attachments/general-miata-chat-9/146434-msm-into-99-313f141d-46ca-4307-888b-e3393597c5f8_zpsg3d8akvl.jpg?dateline=1439089730)
Tomorrow, I hope toget the rest of the plumbing and the factory inter-cooler installed. It looks like I will have to make a few brackets, as the 99 does not seem to have any of the mounting holes used on the MSM. Not that I am surprised.
![](https://www.miataturbo.net/attachments/general-miata-chat-9/146431-msm-into-99-c49397a7-e3aa-417e-b430-024eedf7a795_zpsrluedage.jpg?dateline=1439089730)
This took about three hours, as for the most of it I was working alone. I had some help in the end, which made it a LOT easier.
I also started to install the inter-cooler plumbing. However, I quickly found that the driver's side headlight would be an issue. I pretty much knew it would anyway, as it covers the hole that the piping uses to go thru the body.
![](https://www.miataturbo.net/attachments/general-miata-chat-9/146432-msm-into-99-02a89559-ee01-48bc-a794-4b183e0585e2_zpsdftbgtow.jpg?dateline=1439089730)
This left me with two choices.. Buy new piping and reroute it... Or modify my headlight. Since I have a spare set of headlights and I am glutton for punishment.... I went with the modification route.
All I did was cut away the back corner of the housing. I will reseal it once I make some minor adjustments.
![](https://www.miataturbo.net/attachments/general-miata-chat-9/146433-msm-into-99-44d9ccd8-dd37-4144-be1a-aa31e1edb7c2_zpsoqumfsuo.jpg?dateline=1439089730)
![](https://www.miataturbo.net/attachments/general-miata-chat-9/146434-msm-into-99-313f141d-46ca-4307-888b-e3393597c5f8_zpsg3d8akvl.jpg?dateline=1439089730)
Tomorrow, I hope toget the rest of the plumbing and the factory inter-cooler installed. It looks like I will have to make a few brackets, as the 99 does not seem to have any of the mounting holes used on the MSM. Not that I am surprised.
#42
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Also today, I did some dis-assembly of my original motor, which blew at around 168k miles, while on a Tail of the Dragon run in March. Cylinder #3 had a hole in each side of the block and LOTS of carnage. I found about 3/4's of the piston, but the rest is likely on the the dragon somewhere.
I will let the pictures speak for themselves, but it is safe to say the motor is a complete write off![big grin](https://www.miataturbo.net/images/smilies/biggrin.gif)
![](https://www.miataturbo.net/attachments/general-miata-chat-9/146436-msm-into-99-09995e6c-93e4-4202-b872-611ccc07c990_zpscfiql29i.jpg?dateline=1439089994)
![](https://www.miataturbo.net/attachments/general-miata-chat-9/146437-msm-into-99-579660df-b891-4e36-8c8e-8572da661651_zpsqhn4y8gb.jpg?dateline=1439089994)
![](https://www.miataturbo.net/attachments/general-miata-chat-9/146438-msm-into-99-c52d674d-b6b2-4908-b9de-4950e1cbe62c_zpszs7wabta.jpg?dateline=1439089994)
![](https://www.miataturbo.net/attachments/general-miata-chat-9/146439-msm-into-99-d99b58fe-689f-40e3-ad81-c51af8d75c47_zpsjbw0eeel.jpg?dateline=1439089994)
![](https://www.miataturbo.net/attachments/general-miata-chat-9/146440-msm-into-99-6d6a6a83-0ce3-40c1-a9fa-660361abaf04_zpstf3ac12m.jpg?dateline=1439089994)
The head looks salvageable... With a valve job. But that is it.
All of the journals felt like they had been gone over with 80 grit sandpaper.
I will let the pictures speak for themselves, but it is safe to say the motor is a complete write off
![big grin](https://www.miataturbo.net/images/smilies/biggrin.gif)
![](https://www.miataturbo.net/attachments/general-miata-chat-9/146436-msm-into-99-09995e6c-93e4-4202-b872-611ccc07c990_zpscfiql29i.jpg?dateline=1439089994)
![](https://www.miataturbo.net/attachments/general-miata-chat-9/146437-msm-into-99-579660df-b891-4e36-8c8e-8572da661651_zpsqhn4y8gb.jpg?dateline=1439089994)
![](https://www.miataturbo.net/attachments/general-miata-chat-9/146438-msm-into-99-c52d674d-b6b2-4908-b9de-4950e1cbe62c_zpszs7wabta.jpg?dateline=1439089994)
![](https://www.miataturbo.net/attachments/general-miata-chat-9/146439-msm-into-99-d99b58fe-689f-40e3-ad81-c51af8d75c47_zpsjbw0eeel.jpg?dateline=1439089994)
![](https://www.miataturbo.net/attachments/general-miata-chat-9/146440-msm-into-99-6d6a6a83-0ce3-40c1-a9fa-660361abaf04_zpstf3ac12m.jpg?dateline=1439089994)
The head looks salvageable... With a valve job. But that is it.
All of the journals felt like they had been gone over with 80 grit sandpaper.
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It is looking a bit more and more like a Mazdaspeed under the hood. Cluttered and Crammed full!
I had to undo my full wire tuck, to be able to reach all the sensors. So this is going to take a bit of time to get looking clean again.
I had to undo my full wire tuck, to be able to reach all the sensors. So this is going to take a bit of time to get looking clean again.
![](https://www.miataturbo.net/attachments/general-miata-chat-9/146481-msm-into-99-0aec65c6-edd4-4bb4-b97b-fbb40fa90be1_zpszbw6lshw.jpg?dateline=1439166522)
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Thanks!
I plan to. But first I want to get it running with all the stock goodies. That and I have spent enough for a couple months on this project ![big grin](https://www.miataturbo.net/images/smilies/biggrin.gif)
I am a bit bummed also that I had to give up on the Air Conditioning for now.
The MSM Compressor and the 99 compressor fittings are not compatible. So I removed ALL the AC stuff for now.... Except the two hard lines to the firewall. Those I will cap off. This winter, I will take it to an AC shop and have them make up the lines I need, to use the MSM Compressor on the 99 system.
Also I am still having a hell of a time getting the coldside I/C lines to fit. I know I am doing something wrong. But as of yet I haven't found a good reference photo to show me exactly what. A buddy is supposed to come by with him MSM soon, so I can look at it.
![big grin](https://www.miataturbo.net/images/smilies/biggrin.gif)
I am a bit bummed also that I had to give up on the Air Conditioning for now.
The MSM Compressor and the 99 compressor fittings are not compatible. So I removed ALL the AC stuff for now.... Except the two hard lines to the firewall. Those I will cap off. This winter, I will take it to an AC shop and have them make up the lines I need, to use the MSM Compressor on the 99 system.
Also I am still having a hell of a time getting the coldside I/C lines to fit. I know I am doing something wrong. But as of yet I haven't found a good reference photo to show me exactly what. A buddy is supposed to come by with him MSM soon, so I can look at it.
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Yes, it would if I had the MSM headlights and bumper. The 99-00 headlights are deeper than the MSM lights. However, I have spent a considerable amount of money on my 99 bumper, grafting the 01-05 large tupperware lip to it, for a unique look... and spent a good sum on the headlights, converting them to Projectors... So, I had no issue chopping a chunk off the headlight to make it fit.
Now, mounting points for the inter-cooler piping and the I/C itself, do not exist on the 99. So, that will all have to be addressed. My buddy is bringing his MSM by today so I can get a better look. However, it looks like I will have to chop off the factory mount on the Coldside hard pipe.
Now, mounting points for the inter-cooler piping and the I/C itself, do not exist on the 99. So, that will all have to be addressed. My buddy is bringing his MSM by today so I can get a better look. However, it looks like I will have to chop off the factory mount on the Coldside hard pipe.
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Well, it decided to storm REALLY hard while he was at my house on his lunchbreak... So, I got a few quick pics of hose connections, but not of the I/C pipes and their connections. So I am still searching.
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I finally got the intercooler piping installed! I had to bend the Mount on the cold side pipe.
![](https://www.miataturbo.net/attachments/general-miata-chat-9/146703-msm-into-99-8034cca2-f615-4000-bfdf-56e61aa8371e_zpswmkcubwc.jpg?dateline=1439347371)
I have a bigger inter-cooler coming from a buddy as well.
Now my biggest issue is getting the ECU setup. I built my DIYPNP MS2 and loaded the most current firmware on it, which it 3.4.0. Unfortunately the Basemap for the 99-00 that DIYPNP offers is for the 3.0.3 Firmware. Phil at DIYPNP tells me that I HAVE to load an old Firmware onto my ECU... I have several issues with this.
As an IT pro, this goes against everything I know. We are not talking about just the previous version.. but going so far back that it is considered Obsolete. Also, there is the fact I am not running a 99 engine... Just a 99 harness. The Coils are the NB2/MSM coils..
I have a stock MSM tune for the MS2 ECU... So I need to figure out what is different between the 99 map and the MSM map and build from there I guess. The only aftermarket ECU I have ever used before was a Haltech... And I knew very little about it.
![](https://www.miataturbo.net/attachments/general-miata-chat-9/146703-msm-into-99-8034cca2-f615-4000-bfdf-56e61aa8371e_zpswmkcubwc.jpg?dateline=1439347371)
I have a bigger inter-cooler coming from a buddy as well.
Now my biggest issue is getting the ECU setup. I built my DIYPNP MS2 and loaded the most current firmware on it, which it 3.4.0. Unfortunately the Basemap for the 99-00 that DIYPNP offers is for the 3.0.3 Firmware. Phil at DIYPNP tells me that I HAVE to load an old Firmware onto my ECU... I have several issues with this.
As an IT pro, this goes against everything I know. We are not talking about just the previous version.. but going so far back that it is considered Obsolete. Also, there is the fact I am not running a 99 engine... Just a 99 harness. The Coils are the NB2/MSM coils..
I have a stock MSM tune for the MS2 ECU... So I need to figure out what is different between the 99 map and the MSM map and build from there I guess. The only aftermarket ECU I have ever used before was a Haltech... And I knew very little about it.
![big grin](https://www.miataturbo.net/images/smilies/biggrin.gif)
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OMG!! So it gets worse.... Apparently the standard MS2 basemaps that I am able to find easily and readily are also supposedly not compatible with the DIYPNP units. I have emailed again, asking for clarification on what is different... And why they will not work.. and WHERE I can download this old version of the firmware that DOES work on these units...
Wow... Just wow....
Wow... Just wow....
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I got a bit more info from DIY Autotune.. it seems that The MicroSquirt module and standard MS2 processors are similar but different modules entirely therefore the tune files are not compatible.
So I am not 100% certain what that means in terms of using a standard MS2 tune file, but he makes it sound like it just flat out won't work.
Also I apparently HAVE to run the MS2/Extra pre3.3 alpha 3 firmware?
So I am not 100% certain what that means in terms of using a standard MS2 tune file, but he makes it sound like it just flat out won't work.
Also I apparently HAVE to run the MS2/Extra pre3.3 alpha 3 firmware?
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No. It was a bone stock 168k mile 99 until the thrust bearing failed and caused what looks like hand grenade level damage in cylinder #3.
However, I now have the proper firmware loaded. I then loaded their 99-00 basemap. After which I loaded a stock MSM tune on top of it, and looked for differences in ports. The boost control is the only port difference I have found yet. Still looking though.
Well, after I mow my yard that is.
However, I now have the proper firmware loaded. I then loaded their 99-00 basemap. After which I loaded a stock MSM tune on top of it, and looked for differences in ports. The boost control is the only port difference I have found yet. Still looking though.
Well, after I mow my yard that is.
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So after discussing this swap with some of my MUCH more knowledgeable friends... I am removing the MAF and getting the GM IAT tomorrow. As such, I no longer need the stock air box either. So, I removed it. Which really opens up the engine bay again!
I have to work on a more elegant solution to mount my cone filter... But for the sake of a pic, I used this Spectre I had laying around.
I have to work on a more elegant solution to mount my cone filter... But for the sake of a pic, I used this Spectre I had laying around.
![](https://www.miataturbo.net/attachments/general-miata-chat-9/146849-msm-into-99-50b9dcdf-30d5-4e32-8457-62ca8e476c46_zps3uuesmah.jpg?dateline=1439516110)