basic motor ?'s
#1
basic motor ?'s
i really love to drive my miata and i was wondering that 115hp felt nice, if 150 would feel better. and my answer is yes.
im running somewhat on a simple build/ budget.
and was wondering if adding a set of aftermarket headers and complete cat back exhaust cold air intake and chip tuning would give me that feeling that im trying to acheive. or is forced induction almost always the answer to get the power. im not looking to fly down the quarter mile just looking to be able to not get smoked by a caravan lol. i have been reading many builds. and i was trying to start mine some where.
i have a 91 red 5spd with a roll bar and 175,xxx miles. 1.6l
im running somewhat on a simple build/ budget.
and was wondering if adding a set of aftermarket headers and complete cat back exhaust cold air intake and chip tuning would give me that feeling that im trying to acheive. or is forced induction almost always the answer to get the power. im not looking to fly down the quarter mile just looking to be able to not get smoked by a caravan lol. i have been reading many builds. and i was trying to start mine some where.
i have a 91 red 5spd with a roll bar and 175,xxx miles. 1.6l
#2
Tour de Franzia
iTrader: (6)
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: Republic of Dallas
Posts: 29,085
Total Cats: 375
You have a lot of reading to do. The short version of the story is that a 99 engines with MS, RB header, and decent intake can make 140whp with excellent tuning, a VVT engine can make 150-160whp though it's not as well documented. I plan to swap in a VVT engine in my car tune the **** out of it, and talk about it with precision detail on this forum in the spring. A 150whp Miata is fun, and can be brutally fast on a road course in similar cars or on a poser track day.
The reality is that another $3500 in turbo parts makes for a wildly fun car but you're only scratching the surface of the kind of money you NEED to spend for a reliable street car. $5k builds a solid turbo daily driver, $10k for a track set-up like what I run. For whatever the turbo kit costs, double it for things like cooling, heat abatement, zip ties, and relearning. When you hit the 10lb/1hp ratio, it's really the sweet spot of a fun car. Fast enough to get yourself a trip to jail at any time and feel like you're the king of the road. On the track, if you spend the money, you'll be able to keep up with C6 Vettes and Bauce 302s with good drivers on similar tires before aero. Once you add aero to the Miata you break into mild super-car territory since we have skinny tires.
I ahve a 60-page build thread where I went from $3700 in turbo parts to a different kit and another $10k in bullshit parts to build one of the best Miatas in the country that you can go very fast on the track and drive to work on Fridays.
The reality is that another $3500 in turbo parts makes for a wildly fun car but you're only scratching the surface of the kind of money you NEED to spend for a reliable street car. $5k builds a solid turbo daily driver, $10k for a track set-up like what I run. For whatever the turbo kit costs, double it for things like cooling, heat abatement, zip ties, and relearning. When you hit the 10lb/1hp ratio, it's really the sweet spot of a fun car. Fast enough to get yourself a trip to jail at any time and feel like you're the king of the road. On the track, if you spend the money, you'll be able to keep up with C6 Vettes and Bauce 302s with good drivers on similar tires before aero. Once you add aero to the Miata you break into mild super-car territory since we have skinny tires.
I ahve a 60-page build thread where I went from $3700 in turbo parts to a different kit and another $10k in bullshit parts to build one of the best Miatas in the country that you can go very fast on the track and drive to work on Fridays.
#3
so if im going to do it. i minus well drop the right amount of money on a daily? im just trying to get like a little more fun. or if i bother doing that will i just make a ton of noise LOL or will i even see anything worth the 500 bux.
also ill keep reading and finding out everything i need to know thanks!
also ill keep reading and finding out everything i need to know thanks!
#4
Tour de Franzia
iTrader: (6)
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: Republic of Dallas
Posts: 29,085
Total Cats: 375
so if im going to do it. i minus well drop the right amount of money on a daily? im just trying to get like a little more fun. or if i bother doing that will i just make a ton of noise LOL or will i even see anything worth the 500 bux.
also ill keep reading and finding out everything i need to know thanks!
also ill keep reading and finding out everything i need to know thanks!
I must warn you though as you're on your first venture into engine management, the gods of tuning will hold you accountable for effort and understanding of basic concepts and execution so the learning curve is steep and unforgiving. It took me about 6-months to really figure out what was going on with my internet friends by my side.
#6
I'll try to answer.
I have experience with 4 different configurations, some of them dyno'ed on a Dyno Dynamics.
1) Stock 91 with 180k, that I currently daily drive.
2) 91 with 1.8 swap and MegaSquirt - Dyno at 94hp
3) 91 with 1.8 swap as above, plus exhintake mod and 2.5" turbo exhaust - Dyno at 102hp on same dyno.
4) 91 with 1.8 swap as above, plus SR20 T25 intercooled turbo @ 10 psi
#1 is basically your car, and from other people's experience on that dyno would be about 85hp. It's miserably slow, even in 2nd gear. It's a ton of fun to drive though.
#2 felt much faster, for only 10hp. The whole rev range just felt better with megasquirt + extra displacement.
#3 felt only mildly faster than #3, but stupid loud (tip: don't run turbo exhausts on non-turbo cars)
#4 is holy ****. If I'm doing 60 in 5th and put my foot down, I'll be at 100 by the time #1 car is at 70. I have no idea how much power it makes, but maybe 160 on a dyno dynamics? 180? I don't know, it's a small turbo. Will find out in spring.
The turbo is BY FAR the most fun, powerful power adder. But to get to get the turbo running, I had to do all the other little things, like wideband, ECU, fuel injectors and whatever. While I was doing all that, my car was N/A (See #2 and #3). I thought about buying a cheap used header - another 5hp maybe? So if you want to do a build, you can do it while N/A and then slap a turbo on for all the glory.
P.S. Dyno Dynamics is a pretty brutal dyno so you can take all of the above numbers and multiply them by 10-20%.
I have experience with 4 different configurations, some of them dyno'ed on a Dyno Dynamics.
1) Stock 91 with 180k, that I currently daily drive.
2) 91 with 1.8 swap and MegaSquirt - Dyno at 94hp
3) 91 with 1.8 swap as above, plus exhintake mod and 2.5" turbo exhaust - Dyno at 102hp on same dyno.
4) 91 with 1.8 swap as above, plus SR20 T25 intercooled turbo @ 10 psi
#1 is basically your car, and from other people's experience on that dyno would be about 85hp. It's miserably slow, even in 2nd gear. It's a ton of fun to drive though.
#2 felt much faster, for only 10hp. The whole rev range just felt better with megasquirt + extra displacement.
#3 felt only mildly faster than #3, but stupid loud (tip: don't run turbo exhausts on non-turbo cars)
#4 is holy ****. If I'm doing 60 in 5th and put my foot down, I'll be at 100 by the time #1 car is at 70. I have no idea how much power it makes, but maybe 160 on a dyno dynamics? 180? I don't know, it's a small turbo. Will find out in spring.
The turbo is BY FAR the most fun, powerful power adder. But to get to get the turbo running, I had to do all the other little things, like wideband, ECU, fuel injectors and whatever. While I was doing all that, my car was N/A (See #2 and #3). I thought about buying a cheap used header - another 5hp maybe? So if you want to do a build, you can do it while N/A and then slap a turbo on for all the glory.
P.S. Dyno Dynamics is a pretty brutal dyno so you can take all of the above numbers and multiply them by 10-20%.
#7
Tour de Franzia
iTrader: (6)
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: Republic of Dallas
Posts: 29,085
Total Cats: 375
Remember that if you're at 90hp now (conservative) and tune up to 120whp, that's a 25% increase in output. It will also teach you how to be a man for the first time in your life and make you want to try women, again.
#8
oh nice thanks for all the input, im going to school for collision repair and once im done this course ina few months ill be taking the engine rebuild eletective and i plan on doing my 1.6 over right.
also when i said 150 it was a strange number i just threw it out. when you said 120 hp a 25% increase thats more what im talking about.
also when i said 150 it was a strange number i just threw it out. when you said 120 hp a 25% increase thats more what im talking about.
#10
if you want to outrun a minivan on its way to soccer practice you'll need boost.
150hp is slow as **** on the street, sorry.
I'd get a starter turbo kit (begi, greddy, etc) and run it at low boost on stock exhaust. you'll make a quiet torquey 150Whp which is a whole lot more than 150hp, and a ton more torque as well, which is the biggest fun factor on teh street
150hp is slow as **** on the street, sorry.
I'd get a starter turbo kit (begi, greddy, etc) and run it at low boost on stock exhaust. you'll make a quiet torquey 150Whp which is a whole lot more than 150hp, and a ton more torque as well, which is the biggest fun factor on teh street
#14
Slowest Progress Ever
iTrader: (26)
Join Date: Oct 2007
Location: The coal ridden hills of Pennsylvania
Posts: 6,028
Total Cats: 304
Welcome to the site Alex.
You're from Philly? How about you drive up to Reading on Saturday and I'll let you drive my car. It has a small turbo and makes about 200whp. That should give you a better opinion. I'd hate to see you spend all kinds of money and not be happy.
You're from Philly? How about you drive up to Reading on Saturday and I'll let you drive my car. It has a small turbo and makes about 200whp. That should give you a better opinion. I'd hate to see you spend all kinds of money and not be happy.