JCarson

Hope y’all are doing well.

I have a 97 with a stage one turbo kit from flyin miata with 640 cc force flow injectors and a speeduino- and it drives like s***

it doesn’t catch idle and stalls out when not in gear, the ecu has the tachometer going crazy (at 5000 rpms on the tach where it’s only at 3400, the tachometer seems to bounce), and it doesn’t stay at a stable 14.7 when at idle and warm but rather bounces between 13.5 and 15.5.

I got the speeduino because 2 capable (work with miatas) and reliable people who work with the tuner told me the tuner has said very good things about speeduino and it was cheap- saying a reliable tune from a good tuner will always be better than a turbo with band aids such as a voodoo box or TDR fuel and timing cards. When tuning, the tuner couldn’t essentially complete the tune saying this is the best he could do with this ecu and that’s what you get for buying a cheap ecu. In hindsight I should’ve asked the tuner directly about that speeduino before buying it.

so my question to you all is this- should I buy a ms3 pro (still have to get inspection in texas for one more year here in tx) or flow test my stock injectors and put them back with with either the voodoo box or the TDR fuel and timing cards?


Initially- I’m leaning towards TDR fuel and timing cards due to being able to get inspection and I’ve heard better things about them than the voodoo box. Price plays a role here (400-700 for voodoo or TDR cards while ms3 is going to be 900-1200 for the ecu and another 600 for a tune from a reliable shop

deezums

iTrader: (3)

I bet the same tuner makes the same **** tune on any ECU you give him. Speeduino isn't the best, but if you can't even make it idle I doubt you'll be able to on MS3 either.

EO2K

iTrader: (37)

Sub'd for eventual hilarity.

Also, let's back up a step...

Can you not revert to stock for this last year of inspection?
How are you passing inspection now?
Does the Speeduino currently pass the inspection?
What are your long term goals?
Where do you want the car to be when you are "done" ?

Without the answers to the above, I'll say MS+tune is probably the "optimal" choice here of the options given. I'm guessing its where you want to eventually end up because you already bought the Speedweenie? Anything you buy that isn't a stand alone is going to be another waste of cash/stepping stone on the way to a stand-alone ECU.

The VoodooThinger is only good for a limited range of adjustment and intended for a very specific and defined hardware setup. If you deviate from the hardware (replace intercooler, change injectors, swap exhaust) or want to operate outside the intended envelope for the Voodoo (turn up the boost, etc) then you are going to run into problems. As long as you are happy staying within that slimly defined envelope then its "okay" but far from optimized. I would not bother with it unless you are absolutely FORCED to do so for some sort of long term compliance.

The TDR p-p-p-p-p-p-p-p-p-p-powercards are not a panacea and while they (probably? maybe?) offer more adjustment range than the Voodoo, again, I would not bother with it unless you are absolutely FORCED to do so for some sort of long term compliance.

IF I read your post correctly and you have to wait a year to get outside the inspection window then maybe you need to wait a year. You said cost was a concern. Don't waste more money now in the short term on hardware that you'll will want to replace next year anyway. Wait a year, eat some ramen/potatoes/oatmeal, save your shekels and buy a proper stand alone ECU next year when you can do it right.

Another option: post a WTB for an older MS PNP for your chassis. The FM turbo stuff is not exactly complicated or exotic and even an older Plug and Play MS2 based stand alone will get the job done. It's not the new hypetrain MS3 PNP Pro but the older MS PNPs are totally serviceable. Again, personal opinion here but I'd rather pay $400-$700 on an older, known working MS than $400-$700 on the Voodoo or the TDR stuff. But that's just me.

thebeerbaron

iTrader: (1)

Your tuner shouldn't be spending his time on getting the car to idle or getting the tach to read right. There's plenty of knowledge around here to help you get that sorted out yourself. Deliver a car that holds a steady idle and I bet your tuner can do his job. I'd hope that a decent tuner would be able to at least get a steady idle, but I can understand the frustration of being asked to set up a car from scratch on a niche ECU like Speeduino.

Jamikins

iTrader: (1)

I messed around with a piggyback ECU (AEM FIC) for a year before going MS3Pro. I believe my current tune on my MS3 has better throttle response and driveability than either the stock ecu or the stock/piggyback config. If you don't have inspection requirements that require the stock ECU, don't waste your time with anything other than an MS3. If cash is an issue, an MS2 is an option too.

Edit: I noticed you have one more year of inspection. You can revert back to stock and wire the wastegate open, pass inpection, put it back to MS3 config, and you are all set.

BTW, 10% off at DIY Auto Tune right now. Matt Cramer is awesome, great company to work with.

JCarson

FYI my idle was at 850 and perfect while timing set to 10 before switching to speeduino- so no he shouldn’t have to mess with that but here we are.

and as far as a niche ECU- he had recommended it to others who then recommended it to me based of his word, or I wouldn’t have gone down the stand alone route at all.

JCarson

very much appreciate everyone’s input!! Please see my answers above

sonofthehill

iTrader: (1)

Um... I think he meant idling nice on the speeduino. Not on the stock ECU. That being said, I have seen tons of "dyno tuned" cars that won't idle right at the track.

thebeerbaron

iTrader: (1)

Pretty much.

How do you know that your ECU is even hooked up right? Is there a wiring glitch somewhere, or a noisy signal on some line? Maybe the reason your tuner can't get the car to idle for **** is because of something you screwed up on the install.

One way to be sure is to get the car to idle right. You don't need a dyno, you just need some time and effort.

If you deliver a car with a rock-steady 850rpm idle to your tuner, he has a much higher chance of success in dialing-in everything else, because the system works.

JCarson

I’m not here to get pre tune set up help as I did it perfect last year- I delivered it with 850 idle with the timing set at 10. Please read before making comments. If you’re here to talk about my set up pre tune- you missed the boat dude.

let me emphasize- everything was perfect and ready to be tuned when he got to be able to tune it. And again- while this is a niche ECU- the only reason I got it instead of the TDR fuel and timing cards was that he spoke highly of it.


****the only reason I’m here are for the pros and cons for voodoo vs TDR cards vs ms3****

other than that, I don’t care for any of your subjective and uninformed advice on what I should’ve done a year ago.

deezums

iTrader: (3)

You've got no idea what you are talking about, and now you're insulting people?

******* moron.

18psi

iTrader: (76)

"my cheap junky car doesn't work right, should I buy a real car, or a bicycle, or a skateboard?"

thebeerbaron

iTrader: (1)

There's your reading comprehension, you

How are we supposed to know that your car was idling at 850 on the speeduino if you don't actually tell us that?

If your tuner took a car that idled at 850 and had a working tach and returned a car that can't idle and has the tach way off, go find yourself a new tuner.

But since you've so clearly stated the direction of this thread.

TDR p-p-p-p-p-p-p-p-p-p-powercards. You'll need at least three. Four if you're a real baller. Come back in a year and tell us all how awesome your car's been running.

JCarson

no, just annoyed with morons that assume I have no idea what I’m talking about and go on tangents not related to the question I’m posing- subjective opinions about ms3 vs voodoo vs TDR power cards.

If I say “I set up the idle to 850 and made sure the timing was at 10” and then someone says “your tuner shouldn’t have to worry about idle- you should’ve already had the idle at 850 before him tuning it” then it’s clear that person not only didn’t read, but missed the point of this post entirely.

this forum is full of trolls and it’s so counter productive....

For those that care- I’ve decided I’m going to put the stock ecu in, wire the wastegate open, put on stock injectors and ecu for my inspection followed by a ms3 with a new tune.

JCarson

so I had the car set at 850 through the stock ecu then developed a base tune that had the timing at 10 and the idle at 850 on speeduino. Tuner said he always starts from scratch and created his own tune.

That said, it can catch idle, but it does stall out while driving if I put it into neutral without babying the throttle down. His tune isn’t terrible- it has kept my car from blowing up and had provided for some fun trips. It does, however, not catch idle at times and has misfires every once in a while which has something to do with the limited ECU that is speeduino.

I’m glad you got your kicks talking **** to a dude on the internet about something unrelated to his question. I’m not here to talk about how the car is now or how it was set up in the past- solely that it doesn’t run very well right now and I was hoping for informed yet subjective opinions about ms3 vs voodoo vs TDR power cards.

Idk why that’s so hard to understand

JCarson

fair enough, I appreciate the actual input. I’ll let you know- though as of now I’m leaning towards ms3 after getting my (last) inspection

deezums

iTrader: (3)

Your car idled on the stock ECU when the timing was set right? I am impressed. Still confused as to why you think any of that matters after switching ECUs...

MS3 sucks dick, I am less than four weeks from throwing mine in the garbage because it is a primitive pile of garbage that can't even maintain cam and crank sync, step 1 of building an ECU. And what's amusing, it sucks the least dick out of everything you listed, by far.

Your tuner still sucks massive *****, though. Am I still understanding correctly in that he told you the speeduino was good, and now that he failed at tuning it sucks? Enjoy the MS3, it will be more of the same now with more options that half work.

Blu

Hey Jamikins, how please tell me how you managed this. I've taken, and payed for, two tunings of my MS3pnpPro, but the throttle is slower than stock, the idle is trash(high, running rich 11.3), and it STILL stalls at decel, specifically with extra accesories on ( headlights, wipers, powersteering) I'm ready to sell my ms3, turbo, everything, and just revert back to stock.