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For science, as well as lower AIT's I am considering a new FMIC.
To that end, I am thinking of using a Garrett core, their smallest one that is 3" x 6.4" x 18". So, a little smaller than, say the Precision or Vibrant "350HP" models. These can be had from ATP with tanks mounted, but I'd like to make my own tanks and mounts. This will replace my CXRacing 2.5 x 5.5 x 21 cored FMIC, which is OK, but not great, and I suspect has 4+ psi pressure drop. Still debating how much I should instrument the two intercoolers... for the science. I guess I would need pressure ports in and out, as well as T/C's in and out. Possibly a T/C on the outlet of the cooling air (between FMIC and Radiator).
However, It will give me some design freedom, and I am expecting that the Garrett core to be a very efficient one, similar to to Bell's.
I have written to Garrett, but have not received a response.
Does anyone have experiences with the Garrett cores?
DNM
No specific info WRT Garrett cores vs others, I can say that I transitioned from a ebay/cxracing core similar to yours for my first stage core to a larger bell core, and went from a smaller bell core to a larger ebay core for my second stage over the last winter and have recorded measurable improvements in IAT (no big surprise).
I can comment a bit on the instrumentation of the cores, and the usefulness of the data and whatnot. I have been running P and T sensors on the inlets and outlets of both cores for several years now. The data that you get there is much harder to interpret than one might think. First of all, you really have to do a density ratio comparison between the two as opposed to simply looking at the pressure. I think you are probably aware of that because you have already pointed out that you need both sensors. The hypothesis that I have arrived at is the velocity of the gas entering the core is different than the velocity of the gas exiting. This is the only thing that makes sense to me, as I always struggled with the pressures on either side of the core being nearly equivalent, but the temperatures being significantly different. The second thing I can say about this data is that the thermal mass of the core plays a huge role in the data you get back. If you look at the analysis provided in the common text, it almost always assumes some sort of steady state loading when comparing say, the efficiency of a core. In real life (at least for me) it is impossible to achieve steady state loading for long enough to reach thermal stability because that would mean staying in a positive manifold pressure situation for an extended period of time. In other words, I would need to experience constant acceleration for an extended duration way past go-to-jail speed. Ultimately, I ended up deriving a technique where I integrated the density ratios from the inlet and outlet of the cores from the time a pull started to the time the core outlet temperature approached the ambient temperature. It requires a bunch of correction and calculation before stuff lines up.
Was it worth it? well - science, but honestly, no
the simple things that I boiled the whole thing down to were:
- core size (thermal mass) is the dominant property for the instantaneous IAT seen at the end of a pull
- core efficiency (turbulators/quality of frontal area/tube vs plate/thickness/ ...) is the dominant property for the duration of time it takes the IAT to return to ambient
- pressure drop isn't ~really~ that important if you are using EBC and have a good compressor and are operating in a decent spot on the compressor map
- dramatically increasing the cores size is really noticeable in terms of response
Ted, do you have pics of how you mounted your pressure taps? They must be positioned correctly to obtain the correct readings.
Your report is interesting.
My street pulls are fine with the unit I have. In fact, the more I read, my track rise may be OK as well.
40F rise on street, that recovers well. At lower boost, track was 30F rise on longest straight, which is full throttle for about 20 seconds. I wish to add 10 or 20 HP to the track, which will likely push me to 40*F rise there as well.
Well, what I can say about the positioning is that I was more concerned about the packaging than anything, so I most likely got that part wrong. Here is a side by side on the second stage core, followed by what it looks like in the application. The first stage is shown in the 3rd pic, but the bungs aren't welded to the new core yet there. I don't seem to have a straight side by side for the first stage, but the sensors are in the end taks in a similar way.
I ordered this TBH, I am likely fine with what I have, but want the experience with the build, and end up better, but smaller.
Smaller to allow more air to radiator, and I'm convinced that the Garrett cores are as good as anyone's anywhere. I plan to add the documentation to my build thread, rather than creating it here.
DNM
Update: 16-Dec-2020.
Always on back-order, so I cancelled, and then placed with Autoplicity. They had stock, it arrived in 3 days, and was $5.00 cheaper. Very well packed and over-packed.
Who knows when we will build the tanks, as some in the family have COVID 19.
Last edited by DNMakinson; 12-16-2020 at 05:37 PM.
For science, as well as lower AIT's I am considering a new FMIC.
To that end, I am thinking of using a Garrett core, their smallest one that is 3" x 6.4" x 18". So, a little smaller than, say the Precision or Vibrant "350HP" models. These can be had from ATP with tanks mounted, but I'd like to make my own tanks and mounts. This will replace my CXRacing 2.5 x 5.5 x 21 cored FMIC, which is OK, but not great, and I suspect has 4+ psi pressure drop. Still debating how much I should instrument the two intercoolers... for the science. I guess I would need pressure ports in and out, as well as T/C's in and out. Possibly a T/C on the outlet of the cooling air (between FMIC and Radiator).
However, It will give me some design freedom, and I am expecting that the Garrett core to be a very efficient one, similar to to Bell's.
I have written to Garrett, but have not received a response.
Does anyone have experiences with the Garrett cores?
DNM
I used to run a Vibrant 350hp intercooler and I switched to a ATP garrett with the cast endtanks I think its 24x7x3 core size, overall size is 34" wide. IAT went down 10*C under full load on long highway pulls. VD showed I picked up +10whp just from the cooler IAT. The internal core design is beautiful. I have some pictures on my phone Ill edit this post and show you some pictures of the core. You wont be dissappointed
Thanks. I’m only looking to match the temperature performance of the Vibrant while lowering pressure drop.
DNM
Not sure which version of the vibrant you have but mine was older with little to no turbulators internally. You might find even with the small Garrett core that it cools more and has a low pressure drop to boot. I did a lot of research and IMO the Garrett core is the best air to air on the market.
10-01-2020, 12:06 PM
Garrett Intercooler Core experiences
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