Lol ^

Might be interested in a 1.8 plate. Mine looks like poo lol

I'd be getting them stamped at a buddies work. Should look nice, we'll see how it goes though... you never know with projects like this :p

qucik question and it may have been answered i tried searching but couldnt find what i was looking for. is there a benefit to using a aftermarket coil like a AEM pencil, or the okada? what about useing then with a capacitive discharge ignition like the dis4 ect? i was thinking of using the aem pencils (not sure what size) and the dis4 but wasnt sure if it would work and be worth it.

anyone?

It may be the new ground breaker idea, I'll stay with what is known to work. David

Split are you profiting of my ideas? I better get a xmas card! :P

@Hot_wheels: Screw the pencil coils. That whole setup is expencive and unnecessary. So is anything "MSD". After all. How many times can you light a fire? o.O

$.02

Has anyone sourced NB coilpack connectors to make plug and play harness? If no, any other approach that could be used, i.e. quick splice connectors?

I dunno, for all I hear it's a 2 ms dwell time, I've run mine for years on... 4-ish ms? And it runs better the longer dwell I give it. 7 might be a bit much, but there's not a HUGE advantage to running them right up as fast as they will go. Try running yours longer, see if it starts faster, revs better, etc.


I have a feeling other folks are right, but I found, if I used the rubber seal that comes with the coils, it just seats perfect on them. There's a spring inside, so I don't feel bad.

The, um, coils work fine even if you pull them back a good inch from the spark plug - still runs. So I'm not that worried. :-)


Hey, are you going to sell just the plates? I've got a working set up, but my plate blows. Plate, nuts/bolts would be great, but I don't need the cops or the wiring. Then again, perhaps I will when I do my motor swap.

I have to agree with the longer dwell time. I just changed from 4ms to 2.1ms and I think the car ran more smoothly with the the 4ms dwell time.

With that being said, I also adjusted the dwell battey correction for the cops to be set to 2.1. I don't know what will happen if I change back to 4ms and leave the dwell correction the same. There was a writup where someone measured all of this info and 2.0 to 2.3 was supposd to be correct. I'll go back to 4ms today while I'm autotuning and then provide what I think.

for MS-II you should use 2.1 and this for your battery dwell curve:

6v 228%
8v 180%
10v 148%
12v 118%
14v 100%
16v 88%

when you put in the dwell number in MS-II you're telling it the max dwell at 14V, which would be 2.1ms. but we typically run less than 14v, more like 13.5v. So with the correct correction curve, this puts the dwell around 2.2ms running normally and closer to 2.5ms at 12v. This is the ideal dwell curve for toyota cops as tested by Jason.

Anybody notice a difference when the motors cold with these coils? Mine are a bitch in the mornings when they're cold. I'm getting used to it now but I have to ride the clutch taking off to keep it from dieing.

nope...ive started/idled perfectly in 20*F weather.

Me too......Never had a problem with cold start.

It's wierd, it'll start/idle fine but getting it going is harder than normal. I suppose it could be something unrelated.

cranking dwell setting????

alternator on its way out?

Couldn't ever get my ms3 to work. Still on the old stock ecu and no added airflow :(

Hello,

I would be interested on that,
Can you send me an email with details?

Thanks,
Sérgio,
sobodah@yahoo.com

Thread revival!

Ordered the plugs from this company today... excited to do it properly without splicing.

Useful thread.... now to sift through the whole thing when i get time...

Matt

I did mine with small spade connectors-- it was rough.

good to hear it! make sure you do some pics etc when you have time - i would love to see this all solved as a plug in and easily replaced setup!

The plugs came in yesterday (slow due to customs and shipping choice to canada... they shipped next day)

The plugs fit nice and are of a good quality, but they are white.

Im going to try to dye them black and see how that goes.

They fit well and seem to be of a good quality.

Why don't you just wrap/cover the plugs with heat shrink or something?.

Rattlecan after they are in.

i googled dying plastic and people do this with their paintball gun junk.

get some vinyl dye and the plastic will absorb it.

or paint... but its not that flexible...

Depends on what type plastic it is whether it will accept dye. Nylon will.

yup ... and I'm doubtful they would mold those plugs w/ nylon given it's properties - probably some run-of-the-mill ABS/ABS blend which can't be dyed to my knowledge.

-Zach

My question, is the capacitor for 1.6 cars only or 1.8s as well? I didnt see any specific info on where to put it, just basically to add it to the 12v source and the ground? I am assuming thats 1 inline of each? Will someone elaborate or have a pic for me? As far as the 1.8 cars go, I was slightly confused on which coilpack harness you splice into...is the other left untouched?

I didn't put the resistor on mine so I can't be much help there but you tap into both coil pack harnesses. If you need help with it I have a crude diagram I drew that helped me with keeping it all straight. If you like I'll post it up later.

can you PM it to me?

Do you need to run one capacitor or two? What happens if you don't run one at all, just curious?

There is no set number of capacitors but the prescribed capacitance was 10'000 uf.
Depending on the value of the capacitors that you, have you need to connect them in parallel for a total of 10'000uf.
If you have a single 10'000 uf capacitor you only need one. If you only have two 5'000 uf capacitirs then you need two and so on. I used two 4700 caps in mine.

I don't remember why the caps were added but I guess they are filters so if you don't have them there may be cases where the coils don't work properly (guess)

Ok cool, no problems using the 2 4700s?

You wired them in parallel I assume. 1 on each power and ground for each coil pack connector?

I actually ran the COPs with the stock ECU ( higher dwell ) and the resistor ground disconnected - no problems with that either...

I wired mine all together in a little Radio Shit project box and that box is wired close the harness. Not 1 for each coil pack.

I may find the limitations of the COP set up when I get my Greddy turbo up and running but right now I doubt that I even need plugs .

So I took my hand at trying to wire up some coil on plugs on my 94, I didnt wire in the capacitor, and I only used the power/ground/tach signal wire from 1 harness, and just the trigger wire from the other, do I need to run both the power/ground/tach wires from both harnesses or will 1 work?

The car turns over but doesnt start. I have a datalog attached of me trying to start the car.

Cranking dwell set at 5.5
running set at 2.5

Ninja Edit: Had the trigger wires crossed, switched and fired right up, anybody had any problems with not having the capacitors in? No so far yet, I am going to put some miles on the setup and see how things go.

Some pictures of my COP conversion, without the hold down plate done yet. Just got done tonight so sorry for the dirty unorganized engine bay. Any feedback let me know, feedback gives ideas to improvements. No capacitors were used.

Attachment 192629
Attachment 192630
Attachment 192631

Were those plugs genuine Toyota ones? It seems everyone has different colours!

yup, come off a Solara, got them on ebay with pigtails for around $75 shipped.

When you tie a capacitor to ground you are trying to conduct some frequency to ground. If you have no problems now that does not mean that your circuit is not as clean as it can be. You should shunt the spike created by the discharge of the coils to ground to keep from having that noise spike induced into the rest of your electonics.

Glad you figured it out man, looks clean!

Here is a picture of the finished product!

Attachment 192621

here is my coils on my bp, i know i have the motor sideways lol...


the harness in the midle of making it, i later added this harness to my haltech harness :D
Attachment 192618
Attachment 192619
Attachment 192620

Sorry if this has been resolved already, I'm at work and can only do so much searching.

I wired and installed my COP setup and got it running on my Braineack built DIYPNP for my 94. It seems to work fine so far except when I hit 4k rpm, my dash tach shoots to redline while my tunerstudio tach remains normal.

Any ideas what could be causing this or what I might need to change on my megasquirt?

I wired all 4 coils to the blue on one original connector, all 4 tach and grounds as well to their respective wire on 1 connector as well as a ground wire to the back of the valve cover. And the triggers to their respective wires on the connectors.
Should I have separated the tach wiring? I just ran 1 wire up to the first coil and then soldered branches into that wire as it passed by the other coils. The other shared wires (GND and +12) are done the same way.

everything should wire together but the triggers where there should be one for a pair.

Thats how I currently have it.

+12 runs from coil 1 to blue on the 1/4 connector with branches soldered in for 2, 3 and 4.
GND runs from coil 1 to black on the 1/4 connector and a lug on the valve cover with branches soldered in for 2, 3 and 4.
Tach runs from coil 1 to black/white on the 1/4 connector with branches soldered in for 2, 3 and 4.
Trigger for 1/4 runs from coil 1 to brown/yellow with a branch soldered in for 4.
Trigger for 2/3 runs from coil 2 to brown with a branch soldered in for 3.

I have a 10k microfarad cap between +12 and GND.
I tried a 1k ohm resistor from +12 to -IGN in the DIAG box with no effect. I'll check later though whether its actually contacting anything. Maybe theres some crud on the contacts or something.

...hmmm

Alright, my mistake. It actually happens exactly at 3500. If I rev up quick, the tach shoots past redline. If I bring it up slowly past 3500, it jumps around as soon as it hits that point.

so i got a AEM twin fire CDI ignition system for xmas, i plan on running a set of the AEM pencil coils with this set up, i dont have access to my car at the moment, can someone tell me how long is the plug boot? theres 2 options for the pencil coils 5.72in or 6.65. which is closest?

http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/AEM-C...Q5fAccessories

heres a picture of the kit btw, i just got the CDI box for now and will get the coils when i get extra money.

So, I see a lot of peoples harnesses for the 1.6 cars what capacitors are you guys running? 10000uF or I have seen two 4700uF in parallel? Any ideas as to what they are impedance-wise, low, high, general electronics? I'm looking on mouser and have found some 10000uF caps but they are freaking huge 21mm diam 31mm L. Any help would be good. Is this schematic correct for MSPNP? Is that a 1K ohm resistor? Where's the capacitor in this diagram?

The schematic shows a 1K ohm resistor (1000 ohm )

The caps can be two 4700uf in parallel, They need to be polarized electrolytic rated at something over 12v. I think mine were 35vdc. They are not shown.

The ones you saw may be rated for a higher voltage or something else.

I didn't run a cap on my MS'd 1.6L and had no issues. I'm still not quite sure what the cap is for and why it's recommended. But I didn't need it.

So wiring two capacitors in parallel sounds good to me, but where in schematic do they need to be?

Between ground and +12V would seems to be logical for me.....

ok, so i just made the Cop setup pictured above for my 93 miata 1.6. when i installed it the car would start and run for a second and then shut off. my tach never moves so that would indicate to me there is a problem with the tach signal. however if i leave the cop set up wired in and leave the cop's on the spark plugs while i have the stock coil pluged into the cars harness the car runs like a champ and my tach works fine. ive checked my wiring a few times and it all appears correct. and i am running a stock ecm. any ideas?????

answered my own ?. had a stupid moment. lol. forgot i had to unplug the stock ignitor chip. duhhhhh

I just ordered myselb the 10000 uF caps to fit in my existing Cop harness. What I did forget is, that as an NB user I got 2 line with ground and +12V separated always for two cylinders.

Can I use two of the 10000uF caps - one in each pair of lines or should they be more like 5000uF each...?

It wont hurt either way.

Thanks!

Whuuut?

I just built mine - not tested or installed - using this schematic http://miataturbo.wikidot.com/cop for 95.5+. It shows common ground and +12v. I'm going to be grounding at the front of the intake manifold and pulling +12v (unswitched) through a relay off the under hood fuse panel. The control for the relay is the +12v that normally powers the stock coils.

So, just wondering Zaphod, where are your separated ground and +12v connected? And, did I miss something before I plug this in and fry it?