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My buddy netted 150 horsepower from a 50 shot on an rb26
Wow! That's impressive. I wonder if some of that additional power was due to increase in boost pressure from larger volume of exhaust gases? You would expect some additional power over what was rated due to additional charge cooling when used on power adder car, but 3x rated is insane.
I ran nitrous back in the late 80s through early 90s but only on small block and big block chevys as that is what I ran in those days, and never combined nitrous with another power adder so this will be a bit of an experiment for me. Thats also why Im starting with smaller additional hp levels but may eventually go up if car responds well and holds together.
You would expect some additional power over what was rated due to additional charge cooling when used on power adder car, but 3x rated is insane.
I've seen intake temps drop over 100*F from the addition of nitrous to charged air. That does as lot for the engine's volumetric efficiency, way more than the nozzles "shot" size rating. On one of my fathers old big block Mopars, he ran nitrous in place of any intercooling for packaging reasons and because it was so efficient in the short bursts that car ran in.
On the RB26 it was a spool assist device and tapered off as the engine reached full boost. The 100whp difference was at the same RPM during spool up and not peak, for clarity. It was a 800awhp car.
Nitrous to boost is akin to adding baking soda to cocaine.
Always has a bigger gain than what you expect.
One big problem with funny gas is that in a single stage system the same amount of nitrous is injected regardless of engine speed or load.
It's way too much at 3000 rpm and not really enough at 6000.
It tapers off by itself...
This can happen at idle which is catastrophic.
The drop in temperature can freeze the solenoids open. This is BAD.
Progressive systems exist, they are far more expensive and require specialized tuning skills.
The cooling factor is HUGE, especially on a car that has increased intake temps.
Nitrous will end up being a more powerful solution for "spooling the turbo faster" but it is not nearly as ingenious as Newaza's original use of an AC compressor.
My father, who is also a car nut, has a XKE that at one time had triple turbos, ITBs, 12 staged injectors, and individual port nitrous injection (both NO2 and fuel) on a 6 cylinder.
Far more complicated than it was worth.
It was a tuning nightmare...
It ended up with a single turbo flowing through a stock fuel injection manifold with 6 normal injectors.
Made less power but it was still enough to decimate the skinny *** rear tires at any speed.
Got the kit installed and tested with 35hp jetting. Didnt have a chance to wring it out as too many people around spot where I test. I did get a couple short hits from about 25mph to get some "seat of the pants" data.. My compressed air system definately spools the turbo harder than just a 35 shot alone, but used in conjunction its pretty gnarly. Although I also took out a fair amount of timing for first test at such a low hp level, it feels like it pulls harder in boost as well. I will be testing a 50 shot next but jetting will be one size rich on fueling as thats what I have on hand. I was hoping to trap 110mph or better in the 1/8th when track opens back up. Judging from initial feel with just a 35hp shot I think a 50 shot will easilly get that goal accomplished if everything holds together and works right.
I did a little testing with the 50 hp jetting today. This level spools roughly equal to my compressed air spool system. Using them together and it spools VERY fast, and running it out car pulls noticeably harder. The nitto drag radials dont have a chance LOL... Will leave it at this jetting level for a while I think.
One observation in case any one else on here wants to try nitrous with a turbo. You will need to lower your boost level before spraying if you want to have the same boost level with nitrous as you had without. . The nitrous will add a couple lbs boost as well.
Hoping track gets up and running soon so I can get some solid data with halfway decent traction. Should be able to improve on numbers posted in my signature quite a bit. Those times were done last year with a gtx3076 .82ar churbo and no nitrous. I'm now rocking a gtx3576 .82ar churbo at same boost level and 50 shot nitrous. Car is most definitely faster up top, but elapsed time was traction limited before. So traction will be even more of an issue now, but once tires hook it goes! Traction and maybe having a slightly tighter torque converter built will be next on the agenda.
Well I finally went out taking the dragy along and got a small amount of performance data using a 50 shot to compare with no nitrous. I use 50-70 mph range to test modifications that are for power as I can usually get decent traction by 50mph with the drag radials and 70mph is not so fast where if the popo sees me he may not take me to jail lol.. Also I can just use 2nd gear. My previous best was 1.05 seconds 50-70mph, and that was at the track. I just got a .89 of a second 50-70mph run on the street, so its definitely making a difference. Cant wait for the track to open and get some solid data on this junk! Will likely test first time at track using 35hp jets as I have yet to test while loaded in third gear.
Update: Found the limit of the stock torque converter. I quess the friction material on the lockup clutch in the converter didnt like testing with a gtx3576 churbo at 35lbs boost combined with a 50 shot of nitrous Lol... The fiction material on the lockup clutch disintegrated. I had to disassemble the valve body to clean out the friction debris as well as flush lines and cooler. Back together and working, but with no lockup.
I contacted Florida torque converter and they will build me one with heavy duty sprags, bearings and frictions for 399 plus 100 refundable core and tax. That is very reasonable so Im going with it. I was previously considering going a little tighter on the stall speed anyways so this works out.
Just had these guys build me a better torque converter. I sent them a core to build and they had it done within a couple days after receiving the core. Super fast service and they will work with you on needed mods and strengthening. I will get this installed and tested soon and will report back any improvements.
Update: Found the limit of the stock torque converter.
That's something I didn't think I'd ever hear on this forum.
Been watching this project with some interest. Drag racing doesn't really tickle my pickle, but innovation is cool, even if it's being used for drag racing.
Well snap! I swapped in fresh built converter yesterday and tested it. It was too tight. I need to send it back to get it loosened a bit to raise stall speed. My fault I quess since I did ask them to tighten it up a bit to lower stall speed a tad. I quess I didnt specify what I meant by a tad. lol.. No biggie though, however I am down to my last good stock converter. I put it in and tested today and all is as it should be for now. Not sure how long this converter will last if I spray a 50 shot nitrous and 35+ psi out of a gtx3576 churbo. I will just use this one until I feel like changing back to the built converter after I get it back. I had 3 good stock converters, down to one!
Update:
My most local track finally opened last weekend(Savannah river dragway). Fist time all year. They did some resurfacing so traction atm is really not much better than on the street. It will get better as more cars with slicks lay down more rubber.
I made some test passes with new turbo setup. Last year I used a gtx3076 with an .82 ar turbine churbo and ran a best of 6.91s et and 106 mph in the 1/8th. Currently I'm testing a gtx3576 .82 ar churbo, after about 6 passes over the two weekends i got a 7.04 @ 106mph with a couple pounds less boost than running last year. Traction was not good due to fresh track surface and my cheap nitto drag radials which may be going away. This turbo setup will definitely get me back into the 6s 1/8th mile, but will require much more careful feathering of the throttle than turbo used last year to do so. If I let off throttle too much to try and regain traction the boost falls off and is very lazy to recover without my spool shot, and unfortunately it takes a lot of air to spool this turbo so most of the stored air is used at the launch. So when I have to feather the throttle for traction its a real challenge to balance traction without losing too much boost. The gtx 3076 .82 recovered very fast once it got going and was much easier to modulate. I have a .63 ar housing I'm going to try for the 3576. Hopefully that will make this turbo behave more like the one I used last year. Looking at the turbine flow maps for the gt30 .82 ar housings vs the gt35 .63 ar housing they appear to have similar mass flow rates with the gt35 .63 having a slight advantage at higher pressure ratios. Was hoping to use the gt35 .82 ar since it has a significant flow advantage, but I think my stock head and cams just cant take advantage of it.
Haven't tried the nitrous at the track yet. I figured I was struggling for traction as it was, no need to make it worse.
Will be testing soon. Hopefully these will give me enough traction to finally test a 35hp shot of nitrous (which likely adds more like 45hp on a turbo car) at the track, which I have yet to do. Looking for high 6.80s and 106-107 mph in the 1/8th without nitrous and maybe 6.70s at 110 with a 35 shot.
I also added another 3 gallon storage capacity to my spool shot system.
Took to the track tonight and after a few tries ran the time below. This was still no nitrous and was running the gtx3076 churbo tonight. I need to learn these tires and figure best tire pressure to run, also need to practice best launch technique with the extra air capacity. I think it may go high 6.70s @ 108mph without nitrous but with more practice on new tires and maybe some cooler air. Im thinking now a 50 shot of nitrous may get me in the 6.60s @ over 110!
Last edited by Newaza; 08-30-2020 at 05:13 AM.
Reason: said same thing twice
Someone sent me a video of one of my passes last night. It was not a good run as the car fell on its face for some reason when I shifted from 2nd to 3rd and only ran a 7.11 at 100mph on this run. However since I really dont have any other decent video on the car running I made it into a youtube video to post here.
I just installed a cheap proform 67005c shift light. I suppose the rpm adjustment dial on the back is just a suggestion LOL... Its only off about 400-500 rpm. Oh well, it was only 25 bucks so I can't complain. It does seem to work once you set the rpm correctly, and by correctly I mean off the tach, not the dial on the back of the light. I haven't tested it enough to see how repeatable it is. Hopefully it is so its not just decoration.
Well crap! I went to the track tonight and broke another converter. The one in the car now thats broken is one I got from florida torque converter. I bought another one from them but this time with stock stall speed, however its built with supposedly heavier duty parts and brazed fins. Its supposed to have a year warranty so we will see what they say. I'm a little bummed about this one giving up as I still havent shot nitrous at the track or really reached the power level I plan on eventually reaching. This supposedly heavy duty converter giving up at the current power level was not expected. Im going to have to rethink how far I want to take this hoopty or redo the driveline with stuff to hold bigger power eventually.
Update:
Sent converter to florida torque converter. They opened it up and said it looked ok inside other than a little bluing on the apply surface for the lock up clutch. Got a fresh converter back. I dug into the transmission and found the intermediate band was broken. So I repaired the transmission with a new band and seals for the intermediate apply piston. I took a little line pressure out to help relieve some of the stress on the band as well. Car is back together and tested. Hope to have at the track this Saturday weather permitting. Looks like Im starting to see the limit for some of the hard parts in this transmission and converter. I quess I cant complain. These old jatco transmissions have exceeded my original expectations. According to the wallace race calculator my 1/8th mile trap speed of 107.86mph and wieght with driver of approximately 2600lbs puts me at about 507hp at flywheel. 1/8th Mile ET-MPH-HP Calculator So the jatco has done well all things considered. However I think I will move on to a built c4 or powerglide at some point next year. I actually intended to do the c4 swap before even trying the jatco. Actually built a c4 to have ready, but I sold it after trying the jatco and having it live. Wish I had it back now lol... Really want to start throwing some nitrous at this thing but the current driveline just will not hold any more so will have to wait until I swap tranny and rear next year.