Moderate Power on 1999
#101
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Retired Mech Design Engr
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For reference, I will repeat my BEFORE from an earlier post, and the AFTER"
BEFORE (With Wastegate)
AFTER
So before was 171kPa @ 6200RPM, and after is 166kPa at 6900RPM. Much better.
Also, looking at the last graph, at the bottom, notice that there is some pulling of timing for Knock. On that same lower chart, there are the (4) knock readings. I'm thinking the knock settings are too sensitive, and I'm not really looking at knock. Thoughts?
Lastly, I took off the summer tires and put back on the Khumo AST's. It's raining, so 2nd gear spins at will. Last time these junk tires are going to be put on the car.
Last edited by DNMakinson; 12-04-2016 at 01:59 PM. Reason: Added Knock Question at end
#102
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Retired Mech Design Engr
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I added the EBC and am mostly finished with tuning it. I still have a bit of overshoot when I punch the gas at 4500 RPM. I have maxed out my street tune at about 230 HP, but I am quite pleased with the torque curve.
I will ask the MS forum to explain to me how injector Duty Cycle can be above 100%, yet the fuel still seems controlled. I'm at 102%, winter gas; and plan to go no further.
Mounted with Double Sided foam tape (temporarily) next to P/S reservoir.
Here are some screen shots, and I will also load the log and msq:
Might that be Knock on Cylinder 3 and 4? I will took logs of the RPM curve at 100kPa (no load) and 160 kPa and the signatures are all similar.
I am finding this quite fun. I still need to finish the sound deadening inside, add a heat shield, finish the switch panel (would be gauge panel, but it may not have any gauges), Headlights, ducting, and install new top.
Remaining tuning is setting up limp mode for failed MAP.
I will ask the MS forum to explain to me how injector Duty Cycle can be above 100%, yet the fuel still seems controlled. I'm at 102%, winter gas; and plan to go no further.
Mounted with Double Sided foam tape (temporarily) next to P/S reservoir.
Here are some screen shots, and I will also load the log and msq:
I am finding this quite fun. I still need to finish the sound deadening inside, add a heat shield, finish the switch panel (would be gauge panel, but it may not have any gauges), Headlights, ducting, and install new top.
Remaining tuning is setting up limp mode for failed MAP.
Last edited by DNMakinson; 03-13-2017 at 12:15 PM. Reason: added knock info and ducting
#106
I put my EBC on a little bracket up on the fenderwell. I don't remember what goes there from the factory, but it fits there perfectly.
Also, I didn't like the plastic barbs that came with the EBC so I bought brass ones from an auto parts store, Dorman PN: 785-410. From what I remember, the plastic nipple was smaller than the nipple on my wastegate actuator so I wanted to change that for a tight fit with the vac hoses.
Andy
Also, I didn't like the plastic barbs that came with the EBC so I bought brass ones from an auto parts store, Dorman PN: 785-410. From what I remember, the plastic nipple was smaller than the nipple on my wastegate actuator so I wanted to change that for a tight fit with the vac hoses.
Andy
#109
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I put my EBC on a little bracket up on the fenderwell. I don't remember what goes there from the factory, but it fits there perfectly.
Also, I didn't like the plastic barbs that came with the EBC so I bought brass ones from an auto parts store, Dorman PN: 785-410. From what I remember, the plastic nipple was smaller than the nipple on my wastegate actuator so I wanted to change that for a tight fit with the vac hoses.
Andy
Also, I didn't like the plastic barbs that came with the EBC so I bought brass ones from an auto parts store, Dorman PN: 785-410. From what I remember, the plastic nipple was smaller than the nipple on my wastegate actuator so I wanted to change that for a tight fit with the vac hoses.
Andy
#110
IDC's can go over 100 because it's basing it's calculation off what's input into it for either global injector sizing or per-injector sizing, which is usually rounded up/down and can vary as much as 5-6% in many cases, sometimes even more. It's never 100% accurate and even if it is, can vary quite often. You tell the car it as (for example) 600cc injectors, when in reality 1 is 659, 2 is 645, etc. and that's before you consider the wild inconsistencies of a return-less fuel system.
I remember I had my MSM injectors up to I think 136% before they finally started leaning out, lol.
Great progress, as is expected from you
I remember I had my MSM injectors up to I think 136% before they finally started leaning out, lol.
Great progress, as is expected from you
#111
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IDC's can go over 100 because it's basing it's calculation off what's input into it for either global injector sizing or per-injector sizing, which is usually rounded up/down and can vary as much as 5-6% in many cases, sometimes even more. It's never 100% accurate and even if it is, can vary quite often. You tell the car it as (for example) 600cc injectors, when in reality 1 is 659, 2 is 645, etc. and that's before you consider the wild inconsistencies of a return-less fuel system.
I remember I had my MSM injectors up to I think 136% before they finally started leaning out, lol.
Great progress, as is expected from you
I remember I had my MSM injectors up to I think 136% before they finally started leaning out, lol.
Great progress, as is expected from you
Well, I looked at the code (MS) and it shows the calc to actually be the called for PW / the actual Time Between Sparks, (TBS = 120/RPM). Seems like a real calculation. However, I agree, that even at >100%, the amount of fuel injected seems to be controlled.
While I have you on the line, think I should boost the torque between 3500 and 4500, or just leave well enough alone?
#114
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(duplicated in Yellow Top thread)
I ran an experiment this morning. Nice and cold, so already 1% more fuel requested due to MAT Corr. Then I changed the target AFR from 11.7 to 11.4 (Fueling is "Incorporate AFR")
Ran full pedal. IDC went to 108%. At that point, Target AFR was 11.4, but Measured AFR was 11.9. I'm pretty sure I'm no longer controlling fuel.
So, for now, I'm backing down max boost at 5500 - 6500 RPM from 194 to 188. Now max IDC is 96%, and AFR's are on target again. Car is peppy enough with that.
EDIT: at 28*, my Direzza ZII, 200TW tires did not disintegrate.
I ran an experiment this morning. Nice and cold, so already 1% more fuel requested due to MAT Corr. Then I changed the target AFR from 11.7 to 11.4 (Fueling is "Incorporate AFR")
Ran full pedal. IDC went to 108%. At that point, Target AFR was 11.4, but Measured AFR was 11.9. I'm pretty sure I'm no longer controlling fuel.
So, for now, I'm backing down max boost at 5500 - 6500 RPM from 194 to 188. Now max IDC is 96%, and AFR's are on target again. Car is peppy enough with that.
EDIT: at 28*, my Direzza ZII, 200TW tires did not disintegrate.
#115
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Added DW100 fuel pump (had to use their sock, as OEM was too large dia hole). Oh well. I could definitely see how the stock sock held reserve fuel vs the DW which was only a filter.
Here is a pull. Not as much boost because I had turned it down, and hotter outside (EBC not pushing up PWM enough). Nevertheless, you can see that with 98% EGO, 90% DC, AFR is running 10.8 instead of 11.7 target. So, yes, my pump needed replacing.
AND, I hate to talk about this, but new Log Manifold has a cracked weld. I'm thinking I did not knife edge the joints and there is lack of full penetration, leading to a stress riser. SIGH
Here is a pull. Not as much boost because I had turned it down, and hotter outside (EBC not pushing up PWM enough). Nevertheless, you can see that with 98% EGO, 90% DC, AFR is running 10.8 instead of 11.7 target. So, yes, my pump needed replacing.
AND, I hate to talk about this, but new Log Manifold has a cracked weld. I'm thinking I did not knife edge the joints and there is lack of full penetration, leading to a stress riser. SIGH
#117
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Somewhere I posted pics of the new mani before it was spray coated. I'll try to find them and post those as well. A member suggested the welds may be undercut, and maybe he is correct.
Had some time and got a picture, over in the above-mentioned thread.
Last edited by DNMakinson; 04-02-2017 at 05:15 PM.
#118
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Some update and pics.
First is the little Power Supply I used to power the LC-2 from the wall so I could get AFR immediately after start-up. Helped me tune start / ASE and now I will pull it out of the car.
Then, I researched and found that good old home insulation fiberglass is hard to beat for sound absorption. So, I put it under the parcel shelf and I think that may be the single, best thing for noise abatement in the car. I also put some beneath the small fuel line access window, but not on top of the tank.
Meets all the important parameters: Cheap, Light, Effective.
And sealed the areas around the roll bar.
I also put an OEM fuel sock on the DW100, after I found I could purchase it separately. I was also going to add a bit of line to the return to prevent fuel starvation (from when I thought this was a common issue, and I wanted to be proactive while the carpet was out). However, the fitting was incorrect:
Lastly, I purchased these 6UL 8" with 2/3 life (will sell) Hankook Ventus 2 Concept 2 tires mounted, and new, 225 Rival S, unmounted. Will get pic of them on car, when on car.
First is the little Power Supply I used to power the LC-2 from the wall so I could get AFR immediately after start-up. Helped me tune start / ASE and now I will pull it out of the car.
Then, I researched and found that good old home insulation fiberglass is hard to beat for sound absorption. So, I put it under the parcel shelf and I think that may be the single, best thing for noise abatement in the car. I also put some beneath the small fuel line access window, but not on top of the tank.
Meets all the important parameters: Cheap, Light, Effective.
And sealed the areas around the roll bar.
I also put an OEM fuel sock on the DW100, after I found I could purchase it separately. I was also going to add a bit of line to the return to prevent fuel starvation (from when I thought this was a common issue, and I wanted to be proactive while the carpet was out). However, the fitting was incorrect:
Lastly, I purchased these 6UL 8" with 2/3 life (will sell) Hankook Ventus 2 Concept 2 tires mounted, and new, 225 Rival S, unmounted. Will get pic of them on car, when on car.