Just another K swap...
#201
I wish I had checked back in on this thread sooner! Based on your attention to detail I'm not surprised the first shakedown revealed no engine issues. Nice work!
The Paco stands are a great tool to have. Be aware though, I've seen a few people report that the camber readings are optimistic, but consistent. My hunch is that this is due to the design of the stands effectively loading the suspension like a 0mm offset wheel, while most of us are running 35mm or so. I don't know what bushings those people are running, but my guess is their rubber bushings are compressing where a spherical wouldn't move at all. Those same people said once you have a compensation factor from an accurate laser alignment, you're good to go.
I was a bit miffed to see the price drop over $200 compared to what I paid. I felt better when I remembered the alignments I was able to do in the meantime would have cost me far more than that. Plus I helped a lot of friends out too!
The Paco stands are a great tool to have. Be aware though, I've seen a few people report that the camber readings are optimistic, but consistent. My hunch is that this is due to the design of the stands effectively loading the suspension like a 0mm offset wheel, while most of us are running 35mm or so. I don't know what bushings those people are running, but my guess is their rubber bushings are compressing where a spherical wouldn't move at all. Those same people said once you have a compensation factor from an accurate laser alignment, you're good to go.
I was a bit miffed to see the price drop over $200 compared to what I paid. I felt better when I remembered the alignments I was able to do in the meantime would have cost me far more than that. Plus I helped a lot of friends out too!
#202
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For a long time, I didn't have a great location for DIY alignments, and I had a really good local alignment shop that charged me $50 for a four wheel alignment to my specs. If I still had access to that shop, I wouldn't have bothered with alignments, but they're 300 miles away now, and I do have the shop for it. The price drop on the Paco stands was the clincher.
Thanks for the tip on the camber readings, I'll keep an eye on things. I am a bit skeptical about any difference caused by 0 vs. 35mm offset on the stands with the high spring rates most of us are using. I'm running SADFAB delrin bushings, so I know there's no deflection there. I guess a set of wheel spacers under the alignment stands could eliminate any possible issue...?
Thanks for the tip on the camber readings, I'll keep an eye on things. I am a bit skeptical about any difference caused by 0 vs. 35mm offset on the stands with the high spring rates most of us are using. I'm running SADFAB delrin bushings, so I know there's no deflection there. I guess a set of wheel spacers under the alignment stands could eliminate any possible issue...?
#203
To be clear, I was talking about how the offset puts different loads through the control arm bushings, not the springs. If my theory is correct, with zero deflection from Delrin bushings you shouldn't see any difference. I checked the alignment on my track buddies RSX with rubber bushings after he had a shop do an alignment and my stands read 0.6* higher than the printout. I think the people I read this from were Spec Miata racers, so they can't use anything with lower deflection than rubber. At some point I'll need to get a real check done on my car so I can see if my DIY alignment skills are worth a crap, and if this theory holds true for my poly/bronze bushings.
I'd never have bought the stands either if I had a shop like that! I'm glad I did though, it's certainly taught me a lot and given me the chance to experiment with alignments. I never got that when I paid $120 for a teenager at a random corner shop to give it a go.
I'd never have bought the stands either if I had a shop like that! I'm glad I did though, it's certainly taught me a lot and given me the chance to experiment with alignments. I never got that when I paid $120 for a teenager at a random corner shop to give it a go.
#204
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Lots of updates coming, but for now here's some video. I've been playing with the AiM video configurations and while I've still got some sorting to do, it's getting there....
High Plains Raceway, which is a super fun track to drive. I spent some SIM time learning the track on Assetto Corsa, which got me up to speed pretty quickly, but I was definitely leaving time on the table. Especially in turns 4 and 7, which are pretty intimidating in real life! Best lap was a 2:07.6. A couple of Spec Miata guys were there running 2:12s, and said their personal bests in cooler weather (it was mid 90s) were in the 2:08s.
The 'miss' from the first outing in AZ turned into a full-blown problem with the crank sensor signal, and that prevented me from making any further improvements. Much more on that later...
High Plains Raceway, which is a super fun track to drive. I spent some SIM time learning the track on Assetto Corsa, which got me up to speed pretty quickly, but I was definitely leaving time on the table. Especially in turns 4 and 7, which are pretty intimidating in real life! Best lap was a 2:07.6. A couple of Spec Miata guys were there running 2:12s, and said their personal bests in cooler weather (it was mid 90s) were in the 2:08s.
The 'miss' from the first outing in AZ turned into a full-blown problem with the crank sensor signal, and that prevented me from making any further improvements. Much more on that later...
#205
Dang, that track looks like a good time. I know for a fact that any elevation change seen on camera is much bigger in real life. And it looks like you had the line pretty dialed in as well!
Forgive my ignorance but does your wiring harness include an OBDii port or is the AiM pulling data from the CAN some other way? Either way, I'm a fan of the layout!
Interested to hear what became of the CKP signal problem.
Forgive my ignorance but does your wiring harness include an OBDii port or is the AiM pulling data from the CAN some other way? Either way, I'm a fan of the layout!
Interested to hear what became of the CKP signal problem.
#206
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I've got to make it to HPR! Looks great, and nice driving there.
I just wanted to chime in and say it was great meeting you, your wife, and your dog. Your car is beautiful and I'm super jealous of your rig. Hope to cross paths again soon!
I just wanted to chime in and say it was great meeting you, your wife, and your dog. Your car is beautiful and I'm super jealous of your rig. Hope to cross paths again soon!
#207
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Thanks, guys!
Even with the problems, FM Summer Camp was a great time, and we did get some good laps at HPR!
The AiM SmartyCam is slaved to the PDM and pulls some data from the PDM (GPS, track, G force, brake pressure) and some data (RPM, TPS, etc) directly from the ECU, both via CAN. The data overlay is embedded in the video file, and how it's displayed is configurable in a variety of ways. I spent years screwing around with GoPros, knock offs, and various other camera ideas to get decent video and integrate data and do it on the cheap. None of it worked reliably. The AiM setup turns on/off automatically, integrates the data automatically, and has so far been reliable. I wish I had done it a long time ago, even though it's not cheap, and the video quality isn't as good as it should be at the price point.
Even with the problems, FM Summer Camp was a great time, and we did get some good laps at HPR!
The AiM SmartyCam is slaved to the PDM and pulls some data from the PDM (GPS, track, G force, brake pressure) and some data (RPM, TPS, etc) directly from the ECU, both via CAN. The data overlay is embedded in the video file, and how it's displayed is configurable in a variety of ways. I spent years screwing around with GoPros, knock offs, and various other camera ideas to get decent video and integrate data and do it on the cheap. None of it worked reliably. The AiM setup turns on/off automatically, integrates the data automatically, and has so far been reliable. I wish I had done it a long time ago, even though it's not cheap, and the video quality isn't as good as it should be at the price point.
#208
It was great to talk with you more at FMSC! Thank you for sharing your experience with the AIM and K swap, and hope you’re able to find the cause of your sync issue soon. Your build is inspirational.
I meant to ask about how much time took to overlay the data with the AIM setup, but you just said it’s automatic. That is awesome.
I meant to ask about how much time took to overlay the data with the AIM setup, but you just said it’s automatic. That is awesome.
#210
Awesome to see the car running well! A friend runs an AIM setup on his car and that's definitely something worth looking into down the road for me. I think I recall in your build thread you installed a pressure sensor in the brake line for the MC? I guess that's the only sensor you needed to add for the AIM setup?
#211
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I did add a brake pressure sensor, and it was the only sensor I added specifically for AiM logging. Everything else it gets from the ECU. Obviously, there are a lot of other sensors that could be added (suspension travel, individual wheel speed, etc), but at this point I don't think I'll be getting into that.
#212
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So, to back up a bit, we just spent almost 3 weeks on the road... the first real test of our 'retirement adventures'. The main attraction for this trip was Flyin' Miata's annual Summer Camp in Grand Junction, CO. We started attending in 2012, and have been doing the trackdays since 2014. We skipped a couple of years for Covid and when FM had insurance issues with the trackdays and did AutoX for a couple years. Last year was our first year back, as noted earlier in the thread. We added two track days at High Plains Raceway the weekend before Summer Camp, and fooled around in Glenwood Springs and Aspen in between.
After our AZ trackday in May, I had narrowed down our "miss" to a crank sensor signal dropout. This was pretty clear from the Link and AiM data. I did a continuity check on the wiring and couldn't find a problem, so I picked up a brand new Honda OEM CPS, installed it and hoped for the best.
I got the NA and our E36 Touring loaded up in the trailer, got the trailer hooked to the RV, got the RV loaded up and we were ready to go.
We spent our first night out in Santa Fe, NM.
The next day, we drove to HPR, passing PPIR on the way... HPR sits right next to the highway (sorry about the bugs...)
HPR is a great facility! Definitely one of the best smaller tracks we've been to. Plenty of room in the paddock, power at the RV spots, nice facilities, food on site...
And it's a really fun track to drive. Very technical, with plenty of blind corners and elevation change to keep your attention...
Things started out HOT, and the coolshirt system was much enjoyed!
My wife, headed out on track...
Unfortunately, all was not good.... the CPS problem persisted, and though we did get a few clean laps, it was always an issue. Our first day at HPR was an open lapping day, put on by the track, and it was really enjoyable compared to the usual 'groups' format. That was probably mostly because there were only ~30 cars there. The following day would be with the Porsche Club...
After our AZ trackday in May, I had narrowed down our "miss" to a crank sensor signal dropout. This was pretty clear from the Link and AiM data. I did a continuity check on the wiring and couldn't find a problem, so I picked up a brand new Honda OEM CPS, installed it and hoped for the best.
I got the NA and our E36 Touring loaded up in the trailer, got the trailer hooked to the RV, got the RV loaded up and we were ready to go.
We spent our first night out in Santa Fe, NM.
The next day, we drove to HPR, passing PPIR on the way... HPR sits right next to the highway (sorry about the bugs...)
HPR is a great facility! Definitely one of the best smaller tracks we've been to. Plenty of room in the paddock, power at the RV spots, nice facilities, food on site...
And it's a really fun track to drive. Very technical, with plenty of blind corners and elevation change to keep your attention...
Things started out HOT, and the coolshirt system was much enjoyed!
My wife, headed out on track...
Unfortunately, all was not good.... the CPS problem persisted, and though we did get a few clean laps, it was always an issue. Our first day at HPR was an open lapping day, put on by the track, and it was really enjoyable compared to the usual 'groups' format. That was probably mostly because there were only ~30 cars there. The following day would be with the Porsche Club...
#213
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... and it started out bad and never got better.
1st lap, first session, the cutting out was back with a vengence. The car was almost undriveable. I did more continuity checks, pulled the cps wiring out of the loom, but nothing was working. Then the rain set in....
We had about two hours of heavy thunderstorms, including lightning, hail and torrential rain. And that was it for the day... and the weekend.
We pulled out Sunday morning, headed for the Glenwood Springs area for the next couple of days. Our route was I70 over Loveland Pass, and I wasn't sure how our rig was going to handle it. Even with 11 liters of Cummins and 1500ft/lbs of torque, 54,000lbs is a LOT to move. You just gear down, get the motor in an efficient zone, and grind it out...
1st lap, first session, the cutting out was back with a vengence. The car was almost undriveable. I did more continuity checks, pulled the cps wiring out of the loom, but nothing was working. Then the rain set in....
We had about two hours of heavy thunderstorms, including lightning, hail and torrential rain. And that was it for the day... and the weekend.
We pulled out Sunday morning, headed for the Glenwood Springs area for the next couple of days. Our route was I70 over Loveland Pass, and I wasn't sure how our rig was going to handle it. Even with 11 liters of Cummins and 1500ft/lbs of torque, 54,000lbs is a LOT to move. You just gear down, get the motor in an efficient zone, and grind it out...
#214
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While in Glenwood Springs, we took the Touring to Carbondale for breakfast, then drove up to Aspen and on up to Independence Pass.
The more I drive the Touring, the more I like it. BMW really had something with the E36, it's just a great car to drive. I'm really tempted to S52 swap it...
On Wednesday, we made the short hop into Grand Junction for FM Summer Camp, starting at Grand Junction Motor Speedway.
The more I drive the Touring, the more I like it. BMW really had something with the E36, it's just a great car to drive. I'm really tempted to S52 swap it...
On Wednesday, we made the short hop into Grand Junction for FM Summer Camp, starting at Grand Junction Motor Speedway.
#215
Man, half the regulars on this forum made it to FMSC last weekend! What an awesome road trip for you guys. I'm mighty jealous haha.
Pics aren't showing up for me, though.
Have you made any progress on the misfire concern since last weekend?
I don't think these engines are known for running into radio frequency interference issues often, right? We've got a couple vehicle types at my work (Ford tech) that frequently have various speed sensor issues related to RFI. If you have any sort of Triton-motored vehicle spitting out codes for the trans output speed sensor or CPS signal, it's almost always RFI from an old alternator or ignition coils. Likely not relevant to your concern, just spitballing potential fixes...
Pics aren't showing up for me, though.
Have you made any progress on the misfire concern since last weekend?
I don't think these engines are known for running into radio frequency interference issues often, right? We've got a couple vehicle types at my work (Ford tech) that frequently have various speed sensor issues related to RFI. If you have any sort of Triton-motored vehicle spitting out codes for the trans output speed sensor or CPS signal, it's almost always RFI from an old alternator or ignition coils. Likely not relevant to your concern, just spitballing potential fixes...
#216
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Sunrise Thursday, and I had the cars unloaded in the paddock before it started to fill up.
And the paddock does fill up!
Unfortunately for us, it ended up being another full day of working on the car, without finding a solution to our crank signal woes. And it was HOT. I managed one ‘good’ lap in the first session, but the track was still really slick. My wife never even completed a session. I finally pulled the crank signal wiring completely out of the harness and hard wired it around the firewall connector, directly from the ECU to the CPS. Made no difference. I’m down to thinking it may be an internal fault in the ECU, as unlikely as that seems.
My one and only ‘good’ lap was a 65.28, surprisingly still good for 8th overall, but much slower than the 63.80 I ran last year with the BP engine and only 135whp. Really disappointing.
I did manage to get a pic of my wife on track...
Did I mention it was HOT!?? Our dog was quite irritated that she had to wear her shoes to walk outside on the hot asphalt...
And the paddock does fill up!
Unfortunately for us, it ended up being another full day of working on the car, without finding a solution to our crank signal woes. And it was HOT. I managed one ‘good’ lap in the first session, but the track was still really slick. My wife never even completed a session. I finally pulled the crank signal wiring completely out of the harness and hard wired it around the firewall connector, directly from the ECU to the CPS. Made no difference. I’m down to thinking it may be an internal fault in the ECU, as unlikely as that seems.
My one and only ‘good’ lap was a 65.28, surprisingly still good for 8th overall, but much slower than the 63.80 I ran last year with the BP engine and only 135whp. Really disappointing.
I did manage to get a pic of my wife on track...
Did I mention it was HOT!?? Our dog was quite irritated that she had to wear her shoes to walk outside on the hot asphalt...
Last edited by Roda; 06-21-2024 at 06:53 PM.
#217
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We had signed up for both track days, but were unable to run on Friday... I had already used up every idea I had, and was getting nowhere. Even a chat with @redursidae, who knows a hell of a lot more about Link than I do didn't generate any new ideas.
The upside was I got to walk the pits, look at cars, watch some racing and take pictures, something I rarely get to do. It was great to see redursidae and @Fireindc and chat with them there, and I also got to talk to a bunch more Miata folks.
Another K with aero...
Turbo K...
Rotrex NA
His day might have been worse than mine... that's not dust...
Sonny's super clean NA
The dog did a good job of summing up how I felt after these two days...
The upside was I got to walk the pits, look at cars, watch some racing and take pictures, something I rarely get to do. It was great to see redursidae and @Fireindc and chat with them there, and I also got to talk to a bunch more Miata folks.
Another K with aero...
Turbo K...
Rotrex NA
His day might have been worse than mine... that's not dust...
Sonny's super clean NA
The dog did a good job of summing up how I felt after these two days...
#218
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Saturday it was on to FM headquarters for the big open house and party.
This is pretty much Miata heaven, though I was humbled by how much attention our E36 got.
Again, it was great to hang out with a fantastic bunch of Miata folks for the weekend!
This is pretty much Miata heaven, though I was humbled by how much attention our E36 got.
Again, it was great to hang out with a fantastic bunch of Miata folks for the weekend!
#219
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Man, half the regulars on this forum made it to FMSC last weekend! What an awesome road trip for you guys. I'm mighty jealous haha.
Pics aren't showing up for me, though.
Have you made any progress on the misfire concern since last weekend?
I don't think these engines are known for running into radio frequency interference issues often, right? We've got a couple vehicle types at my work (Ford tech) that frequently have various speed sensor issues related to RFI. If you have any sort of Triton-motored vehicle spitting out codes for the trans output speed sensor or CPS signal, it's almost always RFI from an old alternator or ignition coils. Likely not relevant to your concern, just spitballing potential fixes...
Pics aren't showing up for me, though.
Have you made any progress on the misfire concern since last weekend?
I don't think these engines are known for running into radio frequency interference issues often, right? We've got a couple vehicle types at my work (Ford tech) that frequently have various speed sensor issues related to RFI. If you have any sort of Triton-motored vehicle spitting out codes for the trans output speed sensor or CPS signal, it's almost always RFI from an old alternator or ignition coils. Likely not relevant to your concern, just spitballing potential fixes...
No progress... just unloaded the cars this morning. I'll be taking a look sometime this weekend, and I'm working on getting an oscilloscope to look at the crank signal.
RFI/EM was one of the things I considered, and why I separated the wiring from everything else in the loom. I considered that both ignition and/or VTEC wiring could be sources, but with more than a foot of physical separation, and the CPS wiring being shielded, I don't think that's the issue. And the behavior is like a continuity problem - complete dropout.